Why hasn't prefab construction taken over? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#181

Post by CamperBob2 » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:12 AM UTC

phobosanomaly wrote: post #160

dudus wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a story once told by Eric Schmidt that while on a trip to China he was touring a bridge construction and no heavy machinery was being used, the Chinese officials were pointing it out as something positive because it meant more people worked at the site and it generated more jobs. Eric said they should have given the workers spoons if that was the goal, which caused a couple laughs that were met with anxious…

If it's a government project, the employment may actually be the real goal, less so than the bridge.

See also: countries that maintain a military big enough to fight off an attack from two hostile star systems at once, never mind two hostile countries.

It's the ultimate jobs program.

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#182

Post by mdorazio » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:13 AM UTC

jdhn wrote: post #143

aidenn0 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any skilled job that can be done poorly with little training becomes a bit of a lemon market. I hate painting. I'm also a terrible painter. However, I've given up on ever hiring painters. Every professional painter I've used has either prepped the surface improperly, or put the coats on too thick, to the point where I rub paint off if I brush up against the wall. I'm willing to pay more for better work, but I can't e…

> or put the coats on too thick, to the point where I rub paint off if I brush up against the wall How many coats are they putting on the wall, 5? I've never heard of paint rubbing off because there's too much of it.

Same. This is much more likely to be a problem of poor surface prep and cheap paint than of the paint being too thick.

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#183

Post by solarmist » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:14 AM UTC

person8645 wrote: post #102

irrational wrote: post #60

All of the pictures are of very modern houses. I'd be fine with that, but my wife wouldn't. She prefers more of the Victorian/Queen Anne style of architecture. I wonder if there is a way they could design this system so that the innards are all the same but then you can put different shells around the innards so the home could look modern, craftsman, victorian, etc. Sort of like how you could have 10 cakes that are i…

Architect here. This gets much more difficult if you dive into the deeper problems that architecture attempts to address. Victorian/Queen Anne homes are based around smaller, more numerous, and more specific rooms. The exterior appearance flows from the way that people lived in that time, with the HVAC and construction materials and methods available to them. Ornate hand detailing on the high-quality surviving exampl…

This was very informative thank you.

What trends do you see in architecture/modern (as in tools, best practices and techniques) design and home building?

Also could you recommend any good primers on these ideas/problems for the layperson?

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#184

Post by rapsey » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:18 AM UTC

poulsbohemian wrote: post #161

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You ever notice why all the people satisfied with their custom home are either obscenely wealthy or the kind of people who buy a front end loader just because it's a good deal even if it needs work? There are two ways to get a custom home done right. 1. Be stupidly rich and don't give a crap about how much you spend 2. Do damn near all of it yourself.

Absolutely correct. In fact to expand on this slightly... I've had a lot of clients wanting to find land to build...what they don't understand is how few lenders are willing to lend on just land / single home building projects (at least in my market). Then you add in the well and septic where so many just waive their hands "no big deal right?" Um - it sure is a big deal if you are the "lucky" party who doesn't hit wa…

People lease land to build on instead of buy? That sounds absolutely bananas. (I'm not from the US so unfamiliar with your market).

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#185

Post by solarmist » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:19 AM UTC

caseysoftware wrote: post #9

Or in other terms: "Why haven't Content Management Systems made web development cheaper?"

Close, but how about “Why didn’t CMS make web development cheaper in the 2000s?” I’d say we’re out of the prototype stages, but we’re still working out the kinks and business models with prefab construction. It’s just very early days for it actually being a business because anything physical evolves at least 10x slower than software.

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#186

Post by presentation » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:27 AM UTC

I live in Japan, prefab homes here are extremely common [1] - there's an Asahi Kasei prefab 3-story apartment building going up next door to where I live, and from the old house's demolition to the new building's completion, the notification I received in the mail says it'll be about 6 months from start to finish.

[1] https://www.curbed.com/2017/10/25/16534122/prefab-homes-manu...

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#187

Post by jojobas » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:30 AM UTC

Prefab construction dominates certain areas where many identical concrete houses are built in big series (i.e. cheap Soviet and Russian development projects).

There's not much benefit in doing custom wood framing in a factory, a nailgun is a nailgun.

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#188

Post by hn_throwaway_99 » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:31 AM UTC

rapsey wrote: post #184

poulsbohemian wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely correct. In fact to expand on this slightly... I've had a lot of clients wanting to find land to build...what they don't understand is how few lenders are willing to lend on just land / single home building projects (at least in my market). Then you add in the well and septic where so many just waive their hands "no big deal right?" Um - it sure is a big deal if you are the "lucky" party who doesn't hit wa…

People lease land to build on instead of buy? That sounds absolutely bananas. (I'm not from the US so unfamiliar with your market).

No, I think they meant that many lenders won't be willing to lend you money to buy bare land for a single home building project.

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#189

Post by solarmist » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:33 AM UTC

phobosanomaly wrote: post #179

seibelj wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very well put! And I agree that our retraining systems are horrendous. I’m probably not anywhere near as reasonable as you, as I can point to the government for every problem - why is college so expensive? Federally backed loans you can’t discharge in bankruptcy. Why do so many jobs need licenses that take years and tens of thousands of dollars to get when, for example, cutting hair is something you can learn on Yout…

So, yeah, I'm glad you're a free-market guy because I don't have enough free-market guys to drink beer and argue with. Although I'm not drinking beer (if you are, cheers), and we're not really arguing. I am curious what the mechanism is from the free-market side to prevent increasing income inequality, and regulatory capture by corporations and the wealthy? If we de-regulate, what stops Bezos and Exxon, EvilCorp, and…

Yeah, I can’t see how this goes on for much longer without the rise of a new land independent nobility that “employs” everyone else as “contractors” for food, clothing, shelter and very little else. This year amazon has grown enough to “hire” 500 more families in this city. Please put in your family’s application for warehouse attendant now. With the “white collar” jobs becoming like the butlers/valet of yesterday (the privileged servant class).

Re: Why hasn't prefab construction taken over?

#190

Post by phobosanomaly » Tue, Oct 13, 2020, 4:35 AM UTC

CamperBob2 wrote: post #181

phobosanomaly wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's a government project, the employment may actually be the real goal, less so than the bridge.

See also: countries that maintain a military big enough to fight off an attack from two hostile star systems at once, never mind two hostile countries. It's the ultimate jobs program.

The defense industrial complex is the go-to, but I got a kind of novel jobs program that doesn't get thrown around a lot: Private Health Insurance.

There's a straightforward transaction that occurs between healthcare provider and patient. But every...single...dollar that flows through the healthcare system is diverted through the massive private health insurance industry, which is essentially an artificial middleman skimming money off the top of the transaction between healthcare provider and patient. This provides employment for millions of accountants, and MBAs, and marketing people, and database engineers, and statisticians, and lobbyists, and etc.

It's the more touchy-feely cousin of the Defense Industrial Complex that must vacuum up money somewhere in the same order of magnitude.