Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground • Hacker News Board

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#31

Post by adriancr » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:18 PM UTC

fb03 wrote: post #23

aloukissas wrote: post #3

Analog cars uber alles :)

Jokes aside, cars have not been analog anymore for decades ;-( Most stuff (even stuff that looks analog like the speed gauge) now runs thru buses and OBD allows you to tap into almost every controllable aspect of the car if you know the 'right api' for the device.

As long as the control systems are properly air-gapped you should be fine. (doesn't work for jeep apparently due to cost savings... https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-hig...)

won't stop someone physically breaking in and connecting something to the bus but the alarm should sound in that case.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#32

Post by ukj » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:19 PM UTC

mannykannot wrote: post #19

PJDK wrote: post #12

Reading through it seems like people are misinterpreting this. By my reading the car has an anti-theft device that was triggered by the installation of seats. There is a remote system to override the anti-theft device, but that doesn't work because it requires mobile reception. It's kind of funny, but this doesn't really tell you anything about the dangers of "smart cars" or anything.

It tells us that the people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues.

Would you prefer it if the system was designed to failed open?

e.g you could override the security system with a signal jammer.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#33

Post by AwaAwa » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:19 PM UTC

smitty1e wrote: post #22

aloukissas wrote: post #3

Analog cars uber alles :)

Serious question: I think there is a market for a dirt-simple, stripped down car like the original Jeep. If capitalism is so swift, why is the product I want to buy not on offer? Answer: the market is captured, and controlled via government regulation, by corporations that do not see individual owners wrenching on their cars as advantageous. Follow-up: how do we restore capitalism to our (nominally) free market?

Crowd source a Build-Your-Own-Car model kit?

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#34

Post by bigwavedave » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:20 PM UTC

notsuoh wrote: post #14

schainks wrote: post #11

Couldn't some strategically placed cell repeaters solve the reception issue?

Yeah, but I think the broader point I'd that a car shouldn't be disabled like this in the first place due to no reception.

The car wasn't disabled because it lost reception, it was disabled because of an anti-tampering device that activated when the owner tried to install a child car seat (admittedly, what they did to install a child seat that set off the tamper switch baffles me). It remained disabled because the remote support team couldn't fix it since the parking garage was underground and had no cell reception.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#35

Post by sollewitt » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:20 PM UTC

smitty1e wrote: post #22

aloukissas wrote: post #3

Analog cars uber alles :)

Serious question: I think there is a market for a dirt-simple, stripped down car like the original Jeep. If capitalism is so swift, why is the product I want to buy not on offer? Answer: the market is captured, and controlled via government regulation, by corporations that do not see individual owners wrenching on their cars as advantageous. Follow-up: how do we restore capitalism to our (nominally) free market?

Alternative answer: because the market for what you want is too small relative to the cost of producing the thing you want.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#36

Post by TLightful » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:22 PM UTC

fermienrico wrote: post #29

mannykannot wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tells us that the people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues.

Can you write software of medium scale that is 100% bug free? Edit: My point is - We shouldn't be making smart cars and TVs because there are always going to be bugs that are not forceable and can cause your device to brick. I wouldn't want a smart microwave or coffee maker.

Always.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#37

Post by gameswithgo » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:22 PM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #28

mannykannot wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tells us that the people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues.

people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues Is replacing the seats in your car basic?

yes

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#38

Post by callamdelaney » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:22 PM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #26

mannykannot wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tells us that the people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues.

I think preventing your car from being stolen is an extremely basic issue - it's a risk that exists at the back of your mind constantly when you drive an expensive vehicle, so yeah, I'm glad the car does this. The situation in here is more like "haha, ok, we just need to tow this thing out of the garage and try again" - no big deal.

I agree with gambiting. Yeah, it sucks, but just tow your car outside and turn it on again. These things exist for a reason. If it had really been stolen, and there was the work around of 'oh, there's no signal so we'll let the car start and drive off' - then a thief could permanently jam that signal, or remove the electronic device responsible for receiving that signal.

E.g, it's not perfect but it is secure.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#39

Post by mywittyname » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:22 PM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #28

mannykannot wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tells us that the people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues.

people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues Is replacing the seats in your car basic?

OP clarifies in the thread that this was for a child seat installation. And I think that qualifies as something that's pretty basic.

Re: Ferrari is bricked during upgrade due to no mobile reception while underground

#40

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 3:23 PM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #28

mannykannot wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tells us that the people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues.

people who are designing these things are not considering some of the most basic issues Is replacing the seats in your car basic?

[deleted]