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Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

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Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#291

Post by marketingPro »

vbezhenar wrote: post #75
PureParadigm wrote: post #13

This is a complete double-standard. Telegram messages are user-generated content. Is Apple going to start blocking websites in the Safari app? I'm sure one could find a lot worse things than doxxing by using Safari.

If China would threaten to ban iPhones, surely Apple will block websites. The difference is that governments can block websites without Apple approval. But governments can't block app content without blocking the entire AppStore, so they have to reach Apple.

This isn't how technology works. I feel weird saying something so obvious to me but-

Servers/databases have IP addresses that can be blocked just as easy to stop and App.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#293

Post by judge2020 »

throw0101a wrote: post #288
qPM9l3XJrF wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I don't see how this is different from Twitter taking down a tweet which doxxes someone. Would people object if Apple told Telegram they had to remove a channel that was being used by white supremacists to coordinate terrorist attacks? The answer to that question matters, because if users in this thread succeed in making iPhones less of a walled garden, terrorists will be able to use their iPhones to coordinate…

> […] terrorists will be able to use their iPhones to coordinate terror repeatedly on a large scale, and there won't be anything Apple can do about it. And? If they're using (say) Signal or even Messages, it's already end-to-end encrypted and there's nothing Apple can do about it. > Is that really the world you want to live in? You mean like they're able to use GPG/PGP, Tor browser, and Tails Linux distribution to po…

> We've been through this before in the 1990s, and the techies (who tend to often lean libertarian) have generally sided with opening things up even if that meant the baddies also got the same capabilities:

Going in a different direction, you could also look at the state of Windows malware (and adware, eg toolbars) as a potential outcome to the un-walled garden approach: you end up with malware and thus the existence of an anti-malware industry.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#294

Post by antris »

boudin wrote: post #113
_RPL5_ wrote: post #102

Here is a source in Russian [0] saying that Apple is asking Telegram to remove messages that de-anonymize Belorussian police members, rather than blocking channels outright. I don't know whether their source is reliable, but here is the relevant snippet (google translate): > Apple says it didn’t require any channels to be removed. But they demanded to immediately remove any information that discloses someone's data o…

This seems to match this post, where apple is asking to remove telegram groups used to de-anonymize law enforcement members. Apple could do something really simple if they wanted to not interfeer with how people organize their fight: allow to install apps outside of the app store. This would force law enforcement to deal with Telegram directly rather than being able to take advantage of apple's own authoritarian way…

It doesn't change the legal threats of the Belarus government, though. It can still compel Apple to ban self-installs.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#295

Post by marketingPro »

gigatexal wrote: post #237
notRobot wrote: post #20

https://t.me/durov/136 > Previously, when removing posts at Apple’s request, Telegram replaced those posts with a notice that cited the exact rule limiting such content for iOS users. However, Apple reached out to us a while ago and said our app is not allowed to show users such notices because they were “irrelevant”. Fucking hell, Apple. ---- cough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four#Ministry_...

Apple fanboy here and I think this is not a good look for the company. Considering their stance on being stewards of privacy and all.

You are locked in, they genuinely don't care about your opinions.

Getting government contracts and keeping a market open is vastly more important.

Plus the whole privacy thing is just marketing, they have worked with the US government with PRISM. They will keep running the advertisements regardless if they sell your data to a government or corporation.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#296

Post by tgragnato »

boudin wrote: post #113
_RPL5_ wrote: post #102

Here is a source in Russian [0] saying that Apple is asking Telegram to remove messages that de-anonymize Belorussian police members, rather than blocking channels outright. I don't know whether their source is reliable, but here is the relevant snippet (google translate): > Apple says it didn’t require any channels to be removed. But they demanded to immediately remove any information that discloses someone's data o…

This seems to match this post, where apple is asking to remove telegram groups used to de-anonymize law enforcement members. Apple could do something really simple if they wanted to not interfeer with how people organize their fight: allow to install apps outside of the app store. This would force law enforcement to deal with Telegram directly rather than being able to take advantage of apple's own authoritarian way…

Profit.

They are already requiring entitlements to develop things that use the network extension framework (no sideload for VPNs and proxies bypassing the Chinese firewall).

This is just them being forced (again) to make visible the negative sides of such a centralized platform.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#297

Post by wruza »

LockAndLol wrote: post #62

People will never learn: don't buy Apple products. You're locking yourself in. It's your own damn fault you bought their device. It's their device and their OS. They can and will dictate whatever they like. If you're doing something that hurts their bottom line, don't be surprised when they take measures to curtail those actions. They're a company. If you don't want to support their actions, don't buy their products.…

Or you just buy something else for that exact period, in addition to apple. If you go to a war, do you get yourself a gun or just walk there in your kitchen gloves? If you want to make a tasty omelet, do you put your bulletproof vest on?

Why should one product be the answer to all situations? You know that apple is a walled garden. You know that walled gardens have their limits of usage. How does that mean that walls must be destroyed? It is non-sequitur.

Saying that apple interferes with your freedom is like saying a kitchen glove interferes with your right to defend against a knife. It is just an instrument with a narrow usage area, which may or may not fit your current needs.

Let's suppose that I don't support apple's political stances on many things for various reasons, but I will buy new iphone once it is out, because I see value in it. Not surprised if it fails at uprisings, not a problem, that simple. Where the flaw is?

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#298

Post by marketingPro »

redwood wrote: post #164

This makes me sick to my stomach. My wife just got her third Apple product. We've been happy customers. I've been following the news out of Belarus even if there isn't much hope at least the world has been witnessing. How dare they. This is just appalling.

I've been following Apple's outward policy and none of this is remotely surprising.

They have used proprietary devices, banned apps, and worked with governments against their customers.

I can only suggest that either you or your wife takes a marketing class to defend yourself from Apple and other companies.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#299

Post by Wowfunhappy »

dan-robertson wrote: post #272
m3kw9 wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure that country can force Apple to comply with local laws. That’s how it works now.

In this case it is telegram which the government ought to need to compel. Or they could make Apple remove the telegram app. But that hasn’t happened

> Or they could make Apple remove the telegram app.

Which is effective primarily because there’s no (practical) way to sideload on iOS!

This is why I’ve always seen the locked-down nature of the iPhone as a threat to free expression first and foremost. Apple is responsible for setting the system up this way.

Re: Apple tells Telegram to take down protestor channels in Belarus

#300

Post by seebetter »

I just want to point out that we don’t have to put up with this endless creepy corporate invasion of our lives. Eventually Apple, Google and these other behemoths will be disrupted and displaced by technology.

The curve favors the individual not the corporation or the state.

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