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Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

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Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#61

Post by johnday »

subsubsub wrote: post #13
Kednicma wrote: post #3

In addition to the entirety of the author's examples and experiences, we need to recall that the UK/British view of race is heavily influenced by the fact that skin color is not the only way in which folks in the UK experience racial discrimination. For centuries, the Scottish and Irish natives have been variously oppressed by the British, creating a racial context which is distinct from one wholly concerned with ski…

In the last 10 years have a lot of Scottish, Irish or Black people been murdered by UK police officers? 20 years? 30? I'm sure you can think of a few examples, but the idea that the UK is equally as racist as the US is laughable. To be clear: I am not saying that racism doesn't exist in the UK or that it isn't a problem - but the kind of false equivalence you put forward doesn't really advance the conversation.

It doesn't quite fall under your "10/20/30", but a lot of Irish and Northern Irish people were killed in The Troubles by British soldiers - a major event which many remember vividly.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#62

Post by drumhead »

Adele, the singer, was photographed at the Nottinghill Carnival (a massive Carribean street festival over the August bank holiday in London) with her hair in Bantu Knots and wearing a bikini top in the colours of the Jamaican flag. As soon as it was on twitter the you started getting tweets from Black Americans about cultural appropriation, but this was met in turn by fierce opposition from African and Carribean posters from the Uk and Africa who thought she looked great and were incredibly pissed off at the Americans for appointing themselves the global arbiters of what parts of African or Carribean culture were allowed or not allowed to be used by non-Africans or Carribeans. They found the proscriptions to be silly or highanded behaviour. Cultural appropriation doesnt seem to be a problem anywhere else but the USA.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#63

Post by smoyer »

gambiting wrote: post #6

The problem exists elsewhere too, because of the extremely widespread proliferation of American media - I see the Polish media taking american talking points about race, sexuality, religion, and just transplanting them wholesale into the Polish frame of reference as if they were equally important here - more often than not, they simply aren't. While racism is a problem in Poland, it's not a systematic racism like in…

I'm an American and I also lament the americanization of the American media. When I was younger, you watched the news to learn the facts about what had occurred (or was occurring or was expected to occur). I no longer trust that the major news sources are accurate and/or truthful (and I don't even want to talk about those who get their news from social media).

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#64

Post by simonklitj »

m1sta_ wrote: post #41
vinay427 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope you mean today, as in people who are currently alive. Have you read about any history, perhaps including European colonization abroad?

Were they conquering because of race or something else?

Probably money, but that doesn't exclude the obvious racism it created. In Denmark, we had Africans in cages displayed in the Tivoli amusement park in central Copenhagen, so people could look at the spectacle that was the black person (https://nyheder.tv2.dk/samfund/2017-03-31-de-sendte-bud-efte..., in Danish).

While this was not the intent of our colonization and slavery-business, it inevitably caused it, imo. Or, the racism caused the success of colonialism, because it justified it.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#65

Post by Ialdaboth »

gambiting wrote: post #6

The problem exists elsewhere too, because of the extremely widespread proliferation of American media - I see the Polish media taking american talking points about race, sexuality, religion, and just transplanting them wholesale into the Polish frame of reference as if they were equally important here - more often than not, they simply aren't. While racism is a problem in Poland, it's not a systematic racism like in…

Agreed, but you cannot avoid it : the culture of the hegemon always set the norm inside its sphere of influence. There are major symbolic/social incentives for the local comprador elites to adopt American talking points.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#66

Post by brosinante »

HowFarFallen wrote: post #26

>I have privilege as a White person because I can do all of these things without thinking twice about it … I can go jogging (#AmaudArbery). I can relax in the comfort of my own home (#BothemSean and #AtatianaJefferson). I can ask for help after being in a car crash (#Jonathan Ferrell and #RenishaMcBride). I can have a cellphone (#StephonClark). I can leave a party to get to safety (#JordanEdwards). I can play loud mu…

That's certainly a lot of capital double-yous "white" in that generally unsubstantiated comment, friend.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#67

Post by vinay427 »

m1sta_ wrote: post #41
vinay427 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope you mean today, as in people who are currently alive. Have you read about any history, perhaps including European colonization abroad?

Were they conquering because of race or something else?

Something else, presumably, although their justifications usually involved racism of a far more explicit and direct variety than is commonly found today in the US. It's not very difficult to find quotes by rather recent leaders such as Churchill that would be unthinkable by a British (or American) politician today.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#68

Post by netcan »

gambiting wrote: post #6

The problem exists elsewhere too, because of the extremely widespread proliferation of American media - I see the Polish media taking american talking points about race, sexuality, religion, and just transplanting them wholesale into the Polish frame of reference as if they were equally important here - more often than not, they simply aren't. While racism is a problem in Poland, it's not a systematic racism like in…

I agree, but I think adopting the American viewpoint is neither here nor there in terms of dealing with local issues.

The reason these issues are different in different places is history. "Racism" in the states, as a political issue and concept, is firmly rooted in their history. Slavery, civil war, post war confederate politics, etc. Poland, and europe generally, has different historical anchors.

Poland is a prime example, in fact. Consider what Poland was before 1938 and what it is now, demographically, ethnically, culturally, etc. Those things inform the present.

In some sense, interest in US politics may be useful (even if it is often irrational). It's easier to see these things about other countries... like a fable or morality tale. By eventual analogy, it may come around.

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#69

Post by [deleted] »

lewispollard wrote: post #14

> All the individuals listed are American, but most of the people who have shared this on my timeline are British. In trying to express their solidarity with black Britons Aren't they trying to express their solidarity with black Americans? Just because it's happening outside of your country of residence, doesn't mean your compassion and empathy ends at the border.

[deleted]

Re: Looking at the experience of black Britons through an American lens

#70

Post by justinclift »

simonklitj wrote: post #40
gambiting wrote: post #6

The problem exists elsewhere too, because of the extremely widespread proliferation of American media - I see the Polish media taking american talking points about race, sexuality, religion, and just transplanting them wholesale into the Polish frame of reference as if they were equally important here - more often than not, they simply aren't. While racism is a problem in Poland, it's not a systematic racism like in…

We've got to ask ourselves why the media takes on the American talking points, then? Where is the searching of ones own culture and country, so that we might face-off with the unique problems we then have in our countries? Is this a problem of journalism, or is it because it is easier to adopt american problems, and thereby neglect our own, real problems?

Here in Australia, our media seems to wholesale import US content.

My best guess is that the media owners are a) American (and want to push "the American way"), and b) it's somehow cheaper.

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