Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

loyaltylobby.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

271–280 of 294 posts

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#271

Post by stephenr »

mumblerino wrote: post #263
stephenr wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> someone working there legally There is literally zero evidence that he's working here (Thailand) legally . The article only says he works here, at a school. That immigration police arrested him rather than "regular" police, suggests that his employment may not be above board.

They took him 250km away to where the hotel is and imprisoned him there. Does that sound like he was arrested for immigration troubles or this specific defamation suit? Thai police can't speak English, so it wouldn't be out of the ordinary to ask the immigration police (which, by definition, deals with foreigners) to do it.

> Thai police can't speak English

You can say the same about a good portion of the Thai immigration police.

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#272

Post by baby »

leaveyou wrote: post #211
samvher wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Bangkok it was mainly tuk-tuks taking me to places I didn't want to go and many attempted scams (magicians, dealers in jewels, someone pretending to be police). In Chiangmai I had my worst couchsurfing experience, really unpleasant guy who I went to town with and was dependent on (he took me half an hour or so on the back of his motorcycle) and who got really drunk after I asked him to please stop drinking (becaus…

Honest question.. why do you go to countries like these ? To me it looks like the risk is not worth at all.. Is being in danger part of the attraction or people really underestimate the dangers of third world countries ?

Wow, it looks like you probably haven't been around these places in the world, so let me tell you that while we like to discuss about bad experiences, these places are 100x safer and more enjoyable than the US, which is why we travel there in the first place :)

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#273

Post by baby »

katten wrote: post #235
GuB-42 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thailand is actually quite safe. You are going to find a few horror stories but generally, as long as you stay away from the most common scams (which you can find in all travel guides), you will not be more at risk than in first world countries. One reason Thailand is safer than most "third world" countries is that tourism is taken very seriously by the government. Most notably, they have a "tourist police" that can…

Got stuck in a common scam, realizes in the middle of it that I was in a scam with my partner. Mistake to tell my partner that we were being scammed. Partner got depressed, wanted to go home. 3 weeks of sad vacation, have never been more happy to be back from vacation than from that one. Could not "forget" the scam, everything afterwards in vacation circled around the scam. Worth to mention is that my partner was bi-…

It sounds like any bad experience during any type of trip would have depressed you though (don't do drugs!)

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#274

Post by baby »

wittyreference wrote: post #248
nefasti wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had two run un with tugs on New York city. Family got robbed on Orlando, friends on San Francisco. My wife got scammed at London airport by the officers there.

I’ve had zero run-ins with thugs in NYC in my entire life. What the hell were you doing?

police harassed me and my friends twice in NYC, never had any trouble like that in Asia or Europe.

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#275

Post by rendall »

Miraste wrote: post #265
rendall wrote: post #202

I'm going to stand up on a soapbox and use this incident to flog my pet issue, here. It may not be obvious to everyone how it relates, so bear with me. Many people wonder how a "free speech absolutist", such as myself, can hold the point of view that we do: how can we advocate for absolute free speech when it allows anti-vaxxers or bullies or holocaust deniers or racists or fake news purveyors to freely promote their…

I used to think like you do, and I've increasingly come to disagree. Free speech absolutism was a core belief of the open source and early internet community in the 90s and 00s, which is where I picked it up. The idea was that publishing information would no longer be limited to the claws of established powers, and with anyone able to distribute anything, science and art would flow freely over international borders,…

If you could set up a perfect scheme to eliminate fake news, how would you do it?

There is a lot to think about. Would it be a committee that has authority to decide what is true, for example? Comprised of whom from where? Would there be appeals for mistakes? What would a final appeal look like? What would penalties for non-compliance look like? Could you be jailed for fake news spreading? What would prevent abuse: say, an annoyed powerful person labeling something embarrassing but true as fake news? What if, say, a scientific fact that everyone knew turned out to be wrong? How would this be different from fake news?

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#276

Post by rendall »

stephenr wrote: post #252
rendall wrote: post #202

I'm going to stand up on a soapbox and use this incident to flog my pet issue, here. It may not be obvious to everyone how it relates, so bear with me. Many people wonder how a "free speech absolutist", such as myself, can hold the point of view that we do: how can we advocate for absolute free speech when it allows anti-vaxxers or bullies or holocaust deniers or racists or fake news purveyors to freely promote their…

He was free to post what he wanted. He is now free to enjoy the consequences of his previous speech.

What does this mean?

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#277

Post by stephenr »

rendall wrote: post #276
stephenr wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was free to post what he wanted. He is now free to enjoy the consequences of his previous speech.

What does this mean?

Most people whining about “free speech” when something like this happens, are actually calling for “consequence free speech”.

He practiced free speech, and made repeated false or misleading statements about a business.

The business responded, and he now faces the consequences.

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#278

Post by rendall »

stephenr wrote: post #277
rendall wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does this mean?

Most people whining about “free speech” when something like this happens, are actually calling for “consequence free speech”. He practiced free speech, and made repeated false or misleading statements about a business. The business responded, and he now faces the consequences.

Most people whining about “free speech” when something like this happens, are actually calling for “consequence free speech”.

What does "consequence free speech" mean to you?

To me "consequence free speech" means "One must be polite and extend invitations to tea even to those who advocate for the extermination of your race!"

That's not what I mean when I whine about free speech. If that's what you also mean about consequence free speech then we are in complete agreement.

But if by consequences of free speech you mean that a business should be able to use the power of the state to jail and fine those who leave bad reviews even if those reviews are unfair then, you are definitely correct: when I whine about free speech, I am whining about speech laws that enable that kind of behavior. I don't think anyone should suffer those kinds of consequences for that.

Again, many people might think I am "on the side of leaving shitty reviews and hurting businesses" Not at all.

The business should be free to exclude this individual from enjoying their services, and should be free to issue a public statement as they have, telling their side. If that's "consequence free speech" then you and I disagree only about degree.

"The business responded, and he now faces the consequences."

Indeed! Not a society I want. I will avoid Thailand.

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#279

Post by vsl »

hu3 wrote: post #61
dhruvrrp wrote: post #23

Link to the resort’s response from twitter https://drive.google.com/file/d/1VZCwyULmkLpZ7y5nT5wsaX0mn8w... Seems like a messed up situation and i would like to side with the guest, but given I don’t have a culture frame of reference I wouldn’t be too fast to judge the resort.

"There are 3 main reasons that forced us to file a complaint – We are not suing him for just a single bad review: 1. He left fabricated stories on his reviews on TripAdvisor and Google that included xenophobic connotations, accusations of slavery and even comments that could mislead readers to associate our property with the Coronavirus. 2. He had been posting reviews roughly 1-2 weeks apart with obvious defamatory i…

You can see what a load of BS is right from the one review screenshotted in the article. Point 1 boils down to:

- “manager is Czech and full of himself” - xenophobic my ass (preemptively: I’m Czech and no way in hell would I see such statement as having “xenophobic connotations”

- He wrote “avoid like the coronavirus” - that can’t mislead anyone with non-zero reading comprehension to “associate the property”

They’re just bullies.

Re: Hotel guest in Thailand jailed for defamation after posting bad online reviews

#280

Post by stephenr »

rendall wrote: post #278
stephenr wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people whining about “free speech” when something like this happens, are actually calling for “consequence free speech”. He practiced free speech, and made repeated false or misleading statements about a business. The business responded, and he now faces the consequences.

Most people whining about “free speech” when something like this happens, are actually calling for “consequence free speech”. What does "consequence free speech" mean to you? To me "consequence free speech" means "One must be polite and extend invitations to tea even to those who advocate for the extermination of your race!" That's not what I mean when I whine about free speech. If that's what you also mean about con…

> What does "consequence free speech" mean to you?

Pretty much what the dictionary defines those words to mean.

If you say something, and expect people to not react or respond in some way.

The business didn't choose to jail him - once they make a complaint about it, it's out of their (the business') hands what action is taken. The business tried to contact him, repeatedly. He refused to respond, and repeatedly posted his "views" online.

He was given ample opportunity to avoid this result.

> Indeed! Not a society I want. I will avoid Thailand.

Good for you. Personally I'm more focused on avoiding societies where innocent people are imprisoned or killed by police, rather than those where breaking a law results in a punishment.

Post reply on HN