They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video] • Hacker News Board

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#571

Post by kllrnohj » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:14 AM UTC

blackearl wrote: post #448

kllrnohj wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know these aren't real DMCA notices? From the video it's a manual claim, which means it's not Content-ID. The email he received from the support agent also specifically states that they responded to a "complete and valid takedown notice." It also doesn't have the required information that YouTube's manual non-contentid system requires. And, finally, the creator issued a counter claim (stated at 2:40) and s…

0:30 he says "without any evidence at all". A DMCA notice should have "identifying infringing material clearly and specifically". Even though it sounds like a real DMCA notice, it still sounds like YT isn't facilitating it correctly. At 3:55 he mentions not being able to get this information. Seconds later he mentions YT doesn't mediate disputes. So what's going on here? Through their strike system and communicating…

YT never mediates DMCA complaints. That's not their role or responsibility, nor something they can even do at all. DMCA requires the sites receiving them to immediately role over and comply. Which is the system that should be getting the ire and calls for changes.

And the video itself is identified. He does have that information.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#572

Post by kllrnohj » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:18 AM UTC

hnick wrote: post #285

kllrnohj wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Per the video the creator did issue a counter claim, this is stated at timestamp 2:40. He then also states the course of action to follow is either they drop the claim or sue him - this is exactly the DMCA system. As far as I know YouTube's mechanisms do not end in a courtroom.

Sure but if it's a real DMCA claim won't Google be obligated to reinstate the content? https://www.dmca.com/faq/What-is-a-DMCA-Counterclaim There's a summary but it links to a more detailed PDF. If it is a "real" DMCA claim, then according to this Google must put the content back up within 10 to 14 business days. If it's Google's house rules then they don't, but that would mean it's not a real DMCA claim. Now I under…

The content is still up. His channel isn't currently deleted: https://www.youtube.com/c/GarethEvansYT

If his counter claims are successful there's no reason to believe the channel will be deleted, either.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#573

Post by kllrnohj » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:19 AM UTC

theturtletalks wrote: post #496

cedilla wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not entirely clear what type of process actually lead YouTube to terminate this channel, so we can't know either. > there are other extra jurisdictional mechanisms that Google employ to make your life difficult as a creator. That's not quite true. The DMCA is a very strict mechanism. You get a notice, you take down the content, and if the uploader isn't happy with that, they have to sue the claimant. Of course,…

When Github was sent a DMCA for the PopcornTime repo, PopcornTime was able to submit a counter DMCA which allowed the repo to be reinstated. Then, if the repo was really in violation, it had to be proven in court by the original claimant. Youtube doesn't allow creators to file a counter DMCA.

The same thing happened here. The creator issued a counter claim, and his channel is currently still up and unaffected https://www.youtube.com/c/GarethEvansYT

Youtube does allow DMCA counter claims because they legally have to. Youtube has absolutely no wiggle room with DMCA. No amount of complaining to them can ever change that, either. You have to get the laws changed.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#574

Post by AstralStorm » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:20 AM UTC

laughinghan wrote: post #486

stickfigure wrote: post #476

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two days ago I restored a customer's data from backup because they typed "ALL" and hit OK on a dialog that said "This will change ALL of your things, type ALL to confirm". This dialog only pops up if N > 100, and normally makes you type the number (ALL is a special case). I just do not know how to make this more idiotproof short of making them fax in the request. No matter what you think is sane, some insane person w…

It sounds like you found the solution, you just made it really cumbersome: undo. All confirmation dialogs should be replaced with undo. The happy path has lower friction, and in case of a mistake they'll heave a huge sigh of relief. When possible, it's better in all cases for all users, whether novices or power users. And many things that at first blush seem like undo isn't possible, are actually easy to make undoabl…

Unless you're actually trying to do a huge synthetic operation where info would choke, e.g. creating an archive while removing existing files.

That one is still possible to undo, just slower and more expensive...

Then there are fun ones like Windows update holding 20 GB of insufficient undo, mechanical or hardware failures induced by extra load, and how to decide where an operation ends.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#575

Post by AstralStorm » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:23 AM UTC

Crosseye_Jack wrote: post #519

Sophistifunk wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Youtube runs the way it runs because they don't care if a bunch of creators get hosed. All they care about is keeping the copyright wolves at bay.

Under DCMA, on receiving a valid counter notification they are free to put the content back on the site, remove the strike from the content uploader and let the courts handle the matter between the two parties. https://twitter.com/leonardjfrench/status/130794817037951385... It’s only if Google “ignore” valid dmca takedown notifications they are at risk of losing their safe harbour exceptions. How they handle the coun…

They're not afraid of DMCA, but big money pulling out if they're insufficiently aggressive about claims...

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#576

Post by rlayton2 » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:23 AM UTC

Crosseye_Jack wrote: post #519

Sophistifunk wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Youtube runs the way it runs because they don't care if a bunch of creators get hosed. All they care about is keeping the copyright wolves at bay.

Under DCMA, on receiving a valid counter notification they are free to put the content back on the site, remove the strike from the content uploader and let the courts handle the matter between the two parties. https://twitter.com/leonardjfrench/status/130794817037951385... It’s only if Google “ignore” valid dmca takedown notifications they are at risk of losing their safe harbour exceptions. How they handle the coun…

I don't know, but I've read that the counter here is that YouTube's system isn't actually DCMA - they are pursuing copyright over and above that system, and therefore the "protections" in DCMA don't apply - you broke a Google policy, not a law, and therefore you have no recourse.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#577

Post by eru » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:28 AM UTC

dalbasal wrote: post #562

eru wrote: post #542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They really need to start treating content creators with more respect and assume innocence until proven otherwise. Doesn't DMCA and similar law strongly bias them in the opposite direction of having to assume guilt? In any case, transparency seems like a good idea from the point of view of the outside world.

This is a common pattern where law/regulations meet monopoly power: There is a Byzantine bureaucracy that no one understands. The monopoly blames the regulator. The regulator (if they speak at all) blame the monopoly. It's the same way with banks. Any strange and irrational bureaucracy they throw at you is claimed to be legally mandated. This is kind of true, but disengenious.

Alas, yes. That's a big part of why I suggest that regulation, if we want any at all, should focus on lowing the barriers to entry and shy away from mandating specific behaviour.

The latter can be gamed by the people who can afford the good lawyers, and makes entry for newcomers even harder.

Your comparison to finance is apt. It's one of the worst examples of regulatory capture. And many people have very dangerous ideas, eg that deposit insurance is a good idea.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#578

Post by zentiggr » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:28 AM UTC

humaniania wrote: post #494

stickfigure wrote: post #476

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two days ago I restored a customer's data from backup because they typed "ALL" and hit OK on a dialog that said "This will change ALL of your things, type ALL to confirm". This dialog only pops up if N > 100, and normally makes you type the number (ALL is a special case). I just do not know how to make this more idiotproof short of making them fax in the request. No matter what you think is sane, some insane person w…

Require a different user's authentication or admin code to approve an "ALL" transaction.

While there might be emergency conditions that would make this cumbersome, in general that sorry of two person control makes sense. That's why the military uses it for especially dangerous actions or conditions. (Weapons loading on the sub i served on, for example).

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#579

Post by s1artibartfast » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:32 AM UTC

dperfect wrote: post #529

I'm not a lawyer, and I definitely think the whole copyright system needs reform, but I believe there could be legitimate issues with the legality of publicly posting guitar covers as this person is doing on their channel. I'm not very familiar with the channel, but from the little I've seen, I believe the educational nature (and thereby fair use defense) could be debatable. Even if some of his videos are clearly edu…

You also would need the sync license for creating a video which includes the music.

Re: They're deleting my channel, but they don't know why? [video]

#580

Post by rev0lutions » Thu, Sep 24, 2020, 4:32 AM UTC

bestnameever wrote: post #570

jennyyang wrote: post #566

The fact that Google/Youtube has zero support infrastructure should be evidence that they are a monopoly and engaging in monopolistic activity. If Google/Youtube were NOT a monopoly, they would have invested significant amount of money in customer support. However, there is zero. The only reason they get away with this is because they have a monopoly. They are saving hundreds of millions in support costs by not deliv…

> The fact that Google/Youtube has zero support infrastructure should be evidence that they are a monopoly and engaging in monopolistic activity. I'm not sure one has anything to do with the other.

100% it does. it means they have no incentive to justify their actions to the market