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China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

reuters.com

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Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#321

Post by platinumrad »

actuator wrote: post #293
platinumrad wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Call it "whataboutism" if you must, but I think it's strange and counterproductive to ignore the elephant in the room when it comes to influence and control over popular media.

Although I agree with the sentiment that US has a lot of soft power influence, I would argue that most of it is just US capitalism shining at its best. I think the best example of this is WW2 related content like movies. In France public perception of who won them World War 2 changed from Soviet Union in 1940s to US in 2000s. [1] One major difference in US soft power is, they don't censor media critical of them to an…

How is it an example of "shining at its best" when the Soviets made far more sacrifices during WWII only to be robbed of the credit in pretty much all western popular accounts. Yes, they were more brutal to those they defeated in many instances, but that doesn't diminish their military contribution.

The US government doesn't engage in direct censorship like the Chinese government but it does have some power, in practice, to shape its portrayal in the media. The Pentagon pulled production assistance from The Hurt Locker because it didn't like certain aspects of how the military was portrayed[1], as is their right of course. Most films cannot afford this luxury. The relationship between the state and the press is also closer than many think, particularly when it comes to briefings from the intelligence community.

Social media companies like Twitter and Facebook admittedly do a pretty good job of allowing a wide range of views to be expressed, although this comes at the price of allowing massive amounts of disinformation as well.

>try to find something similar on PRC's pointless war in Vietnam which they lost.

How about this one? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youth_(2017_film)

[1] https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2010-feb-25-la-et-hu...

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#322

Post by [deleted] »

medium_burrito wrote: post #300
platinumrad wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's absolutely reasonable for NBA players to not want to comment on complicated issues that are outside of the scope of their political interests[1][2]. It would be nice to see the same humility in other aspects of our public discourse. [1] https://www.radio.com/sports/nba/former-nba-star-anti-china-... [2] https://www.freep.com/story/sports/nba/pistons/2019/10/12/nb...

"Complicated issues", ie outright slavery, which is very much on the minds of Americans?

[deleted]

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#323

Post by godelski »

magicsmoke wrote: post #92
rtx wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not only that, they have many politicians on their books. Even western publications are warry about highlighting what's happening prominently. Today a NYPD officer was caught spying for them. https://abc7ny.com/nypd-spying-baimadajie-angwang-tibetan-of... (caution playing video)

And in an extreme twist of irony, the NYPD officer is ethnically Tibetan.

It may surprise you that Jews turned in other Jews during Nazi occupation. People are people, they don't fit into nice neat little boxes.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#324

Post by godelski »

xster wrote: post #257
liminal wrote: post #10

Han supremacy has all the markings of other supremacist movements and will unfortunately need to be confronted. Not sure when the world will work up the courage to do so, though.

There's definitely some skeletons in the closet. The Han population was 1% in 1950. In the current year, it's 97%. Though I suspect it's not going to be geopolitically convenient for Adrien Zenz to write about the indigenous Taiwan people anytime soon.

Do you have a source on this?

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#325

Post by ceejayoz »

golergka wrote: post #289
bobbyz wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the difference in real terms between the border camps and forced labour camps? The labour? Taking bets that these camps introduce forced labour like the Nazi camps did. Odds stop at the decade. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/07/border-fac...

The difference is the reason to be in the camps. Breaking country's laws is generally viewed as legitimate reason to send someone to prison or camp, while being of a certain ethnicity is not. Of course, there's an issue of laws that are by themselves are morally reprehensible, like the Nuremberg laws in Nazi Germany. However, immigration laws are clearly moral and expected to exist in some form or another in any mode…

> However, immigration laws are clearly moral...

This is not, in fact, universally agreed upon.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#326

Post by crocodiletears »

NotSammyHagar wrote: post #311
crocodiletears wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not appeasement. It's just not worth it. Wasting American blood in a region built up to be defensible specifically against the Americans to save a government that mostly only exists out of spite seems like a poor investment. The kind of withdrawal I described would likely be accompanied by the expulsion of all non-immigrant Chinese nationals, a military build-up in friendly regional territories, and deployments…

What govt do you mean exists only out of spite? You can't mean Taiwan. It's a real country. They are a democracy.

It is a real country, with a real Democracy. But if it weren't for an implicit threat of US intervention, it likely wouldn't be. My point is that its existence strikes me more as an artifact of America's of geopolitical posturing and, a policy of containment left over from the cold war than anything else.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#327

Post by cafard »

apexalpha wrote: post #55

The whole Tibet situation is such a horrible one. From our Western perspective it feels so wrong that they're essentially trying to extinguish an entire culture and 'fitting' it into China. But we also can't say anything because China makes all our stuff. Plus, China isn't going to be impressed when the old Imperial continent with 140 ex-colonies and the current imperial top-dog with 800 foreign military bases are go…

A book for your consideration: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/china-marches-west-peter-c-... .

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#328

Post by ReptileMan »

readarticle wrote: post #288
ReptileMan wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. It wouldn't have been nicer probably since being populated only by ayrians would get boring, but once you are finished with genocide it would be peaceful and strong authoritarian states usually are safe.

Keyword: world Could be safe internally, but that is utterly irrelevant to its neighbors, and the geopolitical order of a world in which the nazis weren’t crushed, the winning empires weren’t dismantled, and the US isn’t the guarantor of global trade and European security in order to combat the Soviets.

If Nazi Germany wasn't stopped we would be living in Man in the high castle world where japanese empire rule over asia, Italy over afrika and germany over all the rest with split of americas. It is potentially peaceful and safe world. Just not nice.

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#329

Post by literallycancer »

platinumrad wrote: post #301
throwaway2048 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think the world would be a safer and more peaceful place if nobody stopped nazi germany?

No, but it honestly probably would have been if the Central Powers had won WWI. American entry into that war was made possible the sinking of the Lusitania, which was secretly carrying war munitions. There is some evidence that the British enabled the event although this is admittedly a minoritarian view among historians (last I checked). It was undoubtedly beneficial for the Allied Powers though. The British Empire…

Yeah, life would be just peachy if half of Europe lived under the Germans or the Ottoman Empire. What? Why do people from large countries act like no one else exists? Would you like to live in a country run by someone who forces their language and culture on you?

Re: China sharply expands mass labor program in Tibet

#330

Post by maxbond »

Fauntleroy wrote: post #290
maxbond wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Past wrongs do not justify present wrongs. It is not wrong for individuals to choose to assimilate. The deliberate and systematic destruction of other cultures - which China is engaged in on multiple fronts - is wrong.

I think the point here is, what are you going to do about it? This is unfortunately how humanity operates. It disgusts me but history shows that it is nigh inevitable.

I don't have the answers that I would wish, but refusing to give up on humanity is a good place to start.

History is prologue, not destiny.

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