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Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

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Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#271

Things in the US seems absurd from an outsider perspective due to ideological beliefs. On the same month, you can read two articles coming from the US: 1) Jeff Bezos Becomes The First Person Ever Worth $200 Billion 2) Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent It doesn't take much thinking to conclude that there is something messed up with resource/capital allocation in this economy. But t…

It doesn't take much thinking to conclude that there is something messed up with resource/capital allocation in this economy

Well, yes. The government forbids people from using local businesses and forces them on pain of terrible retaliation to buy from online services, and Jeff Bezos is very good at running those. That is a messed up allocation of resources but it's not Bezos' fault the government made so many of his competitors illegal to use.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#272
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Federal Reserve? It seems like it could have all sort of just been put on 'pause' for the duration of the pandemic.

The Federal Reserve seems primarily focused on keeping asset prices high. Their policies seem to react directly to downward pressure in the equity markets. When you consider that the appreciation of these markets only serves to widen the wealth gap, it becomes clear that the Fed's mandate is to preserve the wealth of the rich. They're pursuing "trickle down" economics at full speed, despite the overwhelming evidence…

The race issues are part of the financial theft. Racism is used as a tool of division to keep the poor fragmented, people are rightfully trying to destroy that tool.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#273
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want my tax money used to bail out landlords. Let the lenders foreclose. If the landlords didn't want to deal with loans then they should have paid cash for the properties.

> If the landlords didn't want to deal with loans then they should have paid cash for the properties. If the tenants didn't want to pay rent, they should not have signed leases. Why is it that tenants can get a break on their obligations but landlords can't? Why are tenants more deserving of help? Most landlords are not rich. They are providing a service to their tenants, who cannot afford to purchase buildings and w…

Because landlords are trying to profit off of the conditions created by the broader local community. They make a bet on which space created by the community will allow them to extract more rent than the cost to maintain the building and pay the loan, and later sell the property for more than they paid.

Tenants are either members of the community who want a home, or are trying to provide a service to the community.

One group is trying to speculate on the value others will provide and get a cut, and they're able to do this because as they've ensured scarcity of affordable space. It's extraction

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#274
post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those seeking rents should be where the buck stops in a paused economy.

Collecting rents is not the same as "rent seeking".

It's exactly the same. "Rent seeking" means to increase your share of wealth without creating new wealth. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent-seeking

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#275
post #187
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This ignores the fact that if there were such obvious financial incentives, then restaurant owners would simply just buy said properties. 'Property management' is a real thing and businesses don't want to necessarily own property. Managing property is a service like any other - and rates for their goods are market based - just like any other market. "If a landlord is rendered insolvent, they aren't even rendered dest…

> it's not rational to single out one form of business as being 'better or worse' than another. But it is. If a business decreases social welfare (like cartels enabling coordination to jack up prices) the government should regulate it away. Most of what landlords do is cause friction in the real estate market (and hurting everyone else in the process) in hopes to gain some more mpney from it.

"Most of what landlords do is cause friction in the real estate market"

They provide a service just like any other business.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#276
post #262

What's really crazy is that movie theaters in this state aren't allowed to open, but still have to pay their property taxes (which will likely bankrupt them). I have no love for some of them, but bullshit is bullshit.

They are still using the property. If one has an empty barn one pays property tax on it.

Yeah but the government is forbidding you from using your barn.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you thought about how many people need to die for you to change your mind on this one? Just curious where you draw the line.

Have you considered that your favored interventions are, in addition to being extremely harmful to society in every measurable way, probably also completely ineffective in altering the outcomes? Sweden didn't do a thing and is basically done with this nonsense, presumably for all time from the looks of the plots; Massachusetts is still mostly locked down and has 4x the death rate. Lockdown fetishists should be greete…

> Sweden […] is basically done

False, confirmed cases have grown 4.4% since the start of September.

> Massachusetts is still mostly locked down and has 4x the death rate [of Sweden]

False, us/ma has 1.42‰ and se has 0.58‰. That's a ratio of only 2.45.

> "citations needed."

https://covid.observer/se/

https://covid.observer/us/ma/

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#278
post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you considered that your favored interventions are, in addition to being extremely harmful to society in every measurable way, probably also completely ineffective in altering the outcomes? Sweden didn't do a thing and is basically done with this nonsense, presumably for all time from the looks of the plots; Massachusetts is still mostly locked down and has 4x the death rate. Lockdown fetishists should be greete…

> Sweden […] is basically done False, confirmed cases have grown 4.4% since the start of September. > Massachusetts is still mostly locked down and has 4x the death rate [of Sweden] False, us/ma has 1.42‰ and se has 0.58‰. That's a ratio of only 2.45. > "citations needed." https://covid.observer/se/ https://covid.observer/us/ma/

> False, confirmed cases have grown 4.4% since the start of September.

And yet they've more or less had zero deaths per day since the start of August. So yeah, they basically are done.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#279
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s unsurprising that big changes to the legal system can’t easily be made on an ad-hoc, emergency basis. But that’s no excuse for not preparing for the next crisis. Contracts should have a “disaster clause” suspending payment during an officially declared disaster. Perhaps Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae could require this for home mortgages?

Look up “Force Majore”

Looks like it's often insufficient:

> Q: If a contract does contain a Force Majeure clause that includes “epidemic” or some form of the “other causes beyond the reasonable control of a party” language, does that mean one or more of the contract parties do not have to perform, as a general rule?

> A: Not necessarily. First, it should be noted there is not much jurisprudence in the U.S. that address “epidemics” as a Force Majeure event. So the courts have not, to date, had an opportunity to provide clear interpretation or guidance. That is likely to change soon. Second, there needs to be a real causal connection between the occurrence of a Force Majeure event and a party’s ability or inability to perform under the contract. By way of an over-simplified comparative example, consider today’s situation, where there is undoubtedly an “epidemic” of COVID-19 occurring. Most homeowners cannot simply stop paying monthly home mortgage payments even if the loan documents contain language that includes “epidemic” as a Force Majeure event. This is because the Force Majeure event, as expressly stated in the contract, has not directly created an effect that excuses the homeowner’s performance – to pay monthly installments to the mortgage company. In contrast, if a public school district engages a consultant to observe and evaluate students’ use of a new technology in the classroom, and the contract contains similar Force Majeure language, the government’s decision to temporarily close all public schools because of the epidemic precludes the consultant from completing the evaluation.. Very likely, the Force Majeure clause would excuse the delay in the consultant’s performance.

> In between these very simple examples are countless real-world situations that will likely arise as businesses try to predict their respective futures.

https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=5e3f36b8-6ce8...

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#280
It is irrational behavior for these landlords to evict or pileup unrealistic future obligations. On the other side of covid it will be far better to have an existing in place restaurant or bar tenant than to try and lease space in a glut market and take on lots of tenant onboarding costs.
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