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Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

eclecticlight.co

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Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#161

Post by marmaduke »

viraptor wrote: post #124
marmaduke wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this is completely non nondiscoverable I also don’t find this discoverable, but option clicking was best analogy to right clicking on Apple since the mouse used to have one button. Your complaint is like saying that having to copy and paste with ctrl c and ctrl v is non discoverable in Windows with a two button mouse because in Linux it’s just select text and middle click somewhere else.

There's still a lot of software which displays ctrl+C/V next to the matching menu entry.

But you select text with the mouse, it’s understandable to continue the workflow with the mouse

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#162

Post by m463 »

Marsymars wrote: post #36
m463 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is ridiculous, but I can't help but think of cars. I had a car a couple years back, where I had to get behind the side panel of the trunk to get to something (tail light?). The (ford) trunk panel was not held on by a screw, but y a weird fastener that had to be pried out (and I felt like I was breaking it). When it was out, the fastener looked like a christmas tree, and went into a hole easily in one direction and…

The push fasteners are usually removable if you're able to squeeze on the underside of them. Otherwise best way to pry out is with a Y-shaped tool that digs under three sides. I treat them as disposable, like tape or glue, but easier to replace without making a mess of it. They're dirt cheap, so I just rip them out and replace as necessary.

I eventually bought a bunch of them, but the thing is, the car was gone before I pulled any of that apart again. So now I have a bag of fasteners that match no car I own. :)

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#163

Post by timbit42 »

mindfulhack wrote: post #114
rawfan wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would really go with regular Ubuntu for the best support. It really just works and you don't need to put any effort in getting things running smoothly. I went from Ubuntu to macOS as my daily driver because the company switched to Macbooks. I really like the integration of everything. Especially for developers, though, Ubuntu is the perfect OS.

I would have said Ubuntu a year ago, but I've been watching the Desktop Linux space closely for a year now, and it appears Mint is actually more user friendly than Ubuntu, which is quite surprising and nice to know (I'm not a fan of Snap centralisation either). E.g. the GUI app store is superior, it's been demonstrated...along with other things that actually matter under the 'just works' category. Maybe I'm wrong.

Yep. Mint doesn't have snaps and they've switched their base from Ubuntu to Debian. They haven't caught up to Ubuntu yet but I expect them to eventually. I don't care for Cinnamon myself but they still have an XFCE edition and you can install KDE or another desktop without issues.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#164

Post by dangus »

sys_64738 wrote: post #141
mciancia wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Chrome pages are 5x the size of the same page on Linux or Windows. Source?

Did ya try it yourself? I did.

Even if they are larger:

1. How is this Apple’s fault? You’re complaining about a third-party application that Apple has no control over.

2. How can you be sure that Mac and Windows manage memory in the same way?

The nerds who sit around and stare at their computer metrics and gauges on their menu bar or desktop overlay are completely missing the point: is the computer usable and responsive?

I use both Mac and Windows daily and they’re basically the same thing and do all the same things, including running Chrome.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#165

Post by ricketycricket »

brundolf wrote: post #157
ikt wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or boot up Linux and have to fight to get a core function like system updates or audio working How are these issues? Ubuntu has had these sorts of problems sorted for a while now?

Just the other day I was trying to install a package through apt and kept hitting some error about a lock file. After some googling it appeared to be because the OS was doing an auto-update process in the background. Which in itself is something I'd want, but it's insane as a user experience that it would block you from installing anything else and show nothing but a cryptic console error. So then I had to dig in and…

Perhaps the error message should be improved, but your response shouldn't be to kill an update process mid-update and assume everything will be ok. The OS didn't cause that issue.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#166

Post by dangus »

Law of headlines: the answer is no.

Yes, it’s bad that a few people are having issues updating firmware. We don’t know how many are versus aren’t. But the article goes down a technical rabbit hole that regular users don’t care about, and I suspect the number of affected users is minuscule.

Plenty of Windows users including myself never bother updating audio/chipset/WiFi drivers unless there’s an actual problem.

There’s nothing inherently wrong with Apple’s choice to use the OS updates to also update firmware. It’s typically a benefit to the customer: Mac users never had to worry about updating drivers. I’ve owned plenty of Lenovo and Dell systems with infuriating automatic update software and I much prefer Apple’s approach.

There’s nothing inherently wrong with Apple retail employees not knowing how to update firmware. It’s a retail store. There isn’t anything special about it just because it has an Apple logo on the side, and yet every technically inclined Apple customer expects the $18/hour store associates to immediately know how to do complicated things like this.

In reality, I suspect the reason why Apple employees are clueless on what to do is that the problem is so rare.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#167

Post by the_lucifer »

kalleboo wrote: post #129
jmercouris wrote: post #3

It seems all of the engineering resources are going towards iOS and macOS is only an afterthought, a device necessary for making iOS apps... I'll be moving on when I get a new laptop.

They’re doing lots and lots of engineering on macOS - APFS, read only system partition, app sandboxing with user file protection, app notarization, catalyst, SwiftUI, Big Sur native iOS app support, the whole Big Sur redesign, custom T2 controller, ARM Macs. The problem seems rather like they are making too many deep system changes without any bug fix time to let them settle.

Exactly this. There's no breathing time or a tick-tock cycle for large changes to settle down. The last proper one being High Sierra. Three years of consecutive large scale underlying changes are taking a toll on the overall polish and stability of macOS

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#168

Post by vetinari »

majewsky wrote: post #150
vetinari wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is systemd/systemctl still broken on WSL2? How do you deploy on Ubuntu, when the service control layer is incompatible between Ubuntu and WSL2?

WSL2 is just a Hyper-V VM with some UI integrations. It uses an actual Linux kernel rather than a NT kernel personality, so systemd should work like in any other VM.

It is not just Hyper-V VM with some UI integrations. While it uses actual Linux kernel, it does not use actual init system as a just a VM would. It runs Microsoft's /init, which does not handle service management. Not even SysV ones via /etc/init.d.

So if you need service managment, you won't find it under WSL2.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#169

Post by coldtea »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #151
coldtea wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple's inability to admit fault Like? Because Apple admits fault all the time. E.g.: 1) with the updated Mac Pro design and extended apologies for the old Pro format. 2) with the revised keyboard in the new Macbook Pros. 3) Changing from "skeuomorphic" (bad term, but I'll use it) UI to a flater look and tons of other instances...

I clearly remember the upgrade to Yosemite, and how it crippled Spotlight for anyone who (1) didn't have a SSD (2) did an OS upgrade, not a clean reinstall. Ask around the Apple forums, you'll only get a lot of Apple apologists and fanboys telling you to turn it off and on again, not a peep (and certainly no fix) from Apple. Or a better example of the general sentiment that I think OP is going for, Apple stopped upda…

>I clearly remember the upgrade to Yosemite, and how it crippled Spotlight for anyone who (1) didn't have a SSD (2) did an OS upgrade, not a clean reinstall.

I clearly don't remember that case. How was it anything that couldn't be solved by, e.g., at worse removing the spotlight index folder (.v100 or something similar)?

>* Or a better example of the general sentiment that I think OP is going for, Apple stopped updating it's OpenGL implementation, and invented their own API. Definitely a user-hostile choice, but they defend it by saying that Metal is better than OpenGL.*

How is it "user hostile"? As a user I could not care less if Apple uses OpenGL or Metal, but I do care that they get better performance (which Metal gives). I'm also in favor in Apple having easier control of the graphics stack to tailor it better to OS X -- that's the whole point of MacOS in the first place - that it can do its own thing and have a differentiated offering.

>But now Vulkan exists

So? Let any interested party build a Vulcan facade for Metal (if the goal is easy porting).

If the goal is features unique to the plarform, then Metal is the way to go.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#170

Post by brundolf »

ricketycricket wrote: post #165
brundolf wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just the other day I was trying to install a package through apt and kept hitting some error about a lock file. After some googling it appeared to be because the OS was doing an auto-update process in the background. Which in itself is something I'd want, but it's insane as a user experience that it would block you from installing anything else and show nothing but a cryptic console error. So then I had to dig in and…

Perhaps the error message should be improved, but your response shouldn't be to kill an update process mid-update and assume everything will be ok. The OS didn't cause that issue.

As far as I could tell it was only downloading the update, not actively installing it, which just makes the error even more frustrating. I assume the OS would at least show me a real dialog when it was in the process of applying the update. Then again, who knows.
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