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Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

eclecticlight.co

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Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#31

Post by sneak »

brundolf wrote: post #6

> We are heading rapidly towards the corollary to “it just works” being “and if it doesn’t, just wipe everything and re-install”. Is this really all that bad? In the era of everything living in the cloud, it generally takes me only a couple hours to setup a system again from scratch. Not that I've ever had to do this on macOS personally (though I did once on iOS), but if I had, I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.…

Not everyone wishes to submit all of their data to the warrantless government surveillance that cloud storage necessarily entails in the Five Eyes countries.

Much of the data in iCloud is not end-to-end encrypted, giving Apple (and the FBI and US military intelligence by extension) full access to a lot of your data, such as photos or notes. I don’t use iCloud at all for this reason.

Additionally, media production, especially 4K video, is not “in the era of everything living in the cloud”.

Also, many people may compete with cloud vendor service offerings. If I were trying to obsolete a GCP service offering, I wouldn’t store my product development notes in Google Drive.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#32

Post by FpUser »

brundolf wrote: post #6

> We are heading rapidly towards the corollary to “it just works” being “and if it doesn’t, just wipe everything and re-install”. Is this really all that bad? In the era of everything living in the cloud, it generally takes me only a couple hours to setup a system again from scratch. Not that I've ever had to do this on macOS personally (though I did once on iOS), but if I had, I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.…

>"But whenever I boot up Windows and have to fight to get the most basic dev tools working"

Not sure what tools in particular are you talking about. My main: Visual Studio for C/C++, VS Code for various scripting languages, Delphi, Lazarus install and work flawlessly from the first try. So do whole bunch of other software products I use.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#33

Post by iansinnott »

> Apple has long taken pride that “it just works”, but seems to have convinced itself that is inviolate fact

This. Apple's inability to admit fault coupled with decreasing software stability makes life difficult in many ways. For instance, aside from the obvious detrimental effects of OS bugs, it's often quite difficult to find specific solutions without a specific error message. "$APP silently fails" or "Why is my framerate so low?" don't always lead to answers, even though there are probably many others running into the same issues.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#34

Post by mattlondon »

brundolf wrote: post #6

> We are heading rapidly towards the corollary to “it just works” being “and if it doesn’t, just wipe everything and re-install”. Is this really all that bad? In the era of everything living in the cloud, it generally takes me only a couple hours to setup a system again from scratch. Not that I've ever had to do this on macOS personally (though I did once on iOS), but if I had, I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.…

> whenever I boot up Windows and have to fight to get the most basic dev tools working

What are the most basic dev tools are you struggling with on windows?

VS Code + git (perhaps the most basic requirements for me) docker, node/deno etc "just works" on windows. WSL handles anything I need that doesn't have native windows builds which is ultra-rare for me these days. Windows is IME now a very viable option particularly if you are doing web and/or container-based development. I don't see any advantage for OS X any more ... apart from appealing hardware/industrial design if your work is paying for it! :)

Linux though I agree is a cluster-fuck. I frequently suffer daily issues with graphics drivers causing visual artifacts and outright crashes on my work Dell laptop which is my current work daily-driver (although my work Linux desktop is rock solid)

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#35

Post by phoe-krk »

brundolf wrote: post #6

> We are heading rapidly towards the corollary to “it just works” being “and if it doesn’t, just wipe everything and re-install”. Is this really all that bad? In the era of everything living in the cloud, it generally takes me only a couple hours to setup a system again from scratch. Not that I've ever had to do this on macOS personally (though I did once on iOS), but if I had, I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.…

> Re-installing an OS is free (both the materials and, for Apple customers who don't know how to do it themselves, the service).

To make a semi-unrelated quote from Jamie Zawinski, "Linux is only free if your time has no value."

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#36

Post by Marsymars »

m463 wrote: post #25
steffan wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe a better analogy is: You have a problem with your living room light dimmer not working. The solution is to move all of your furniture out of your house, or being generous, just the living room, and then moving it back. Would you consider that reasonable? Assuming you have a backup, then lets say some movers come out (for free) and do the moving. That's not inconvenient, right? After all, you don't have to do an…

It is ridiculous, but I can't help but think of cars. I had a car a couple years back, where I had to get behind the side panel of the trunk to get to something (tail light?). The (ford) trunk panel was not held on by a screw, but y a weird fastener that had to be pried out (and I felt like I was breaking it). When it was out, the fastener looked like a christmas tree, and went into a hole easily in one direction and…

The push fasteners are usually removable if you're able to squeeze on the underside of them. Otherwise best way to pry out is with a Y-shaped tool that digs under three sides.

I treat them as disposable, like tape or glue, but easier to replace without making a mess of it. They're dirt cheap, so I just rip them out and replace as necessary.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#37

Post by jayd16 »

brundolf wrote: post #6

> We are heading rapidly towards the corollary to “it just works” being “and if it doesn’t, just wipe everything and re-install”. Is this really all that bad? In the era of everything living in the cloud, it generally takes me only a couple hours to setup a system again from scratch. Not that I've ever had to do this on macOS personally (though I did once on iOS), but if I had, I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.…

Reinstalling MacOS is easy but setting up tools in Windows is too hard? This just doesn't reflect my own experience. Windows is pretty workable these days.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#38

Post by apatheticonion »

It's been fun, MacOS, but it looks like our time is drawing to a close.

With competitive, affordable AMD hardware and better GPU support, both WSL and Linux (KDE Plasma) offer compelling competition.

The only rebuttal from Apple being extra padding on the UI, so it seems like I am no longer your target audience.

Fair well, it was a beautiful, cohesive experience while it lasted.

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#39

Post by ikt »

brundolf wrote: post #6

> We are heading rapidly towards the corollary to “it just works” being “and if it doesn’t, just wipe everything and re-install”. Is this really all that bad? In the era of everything living in the cloud, it generally takes me only a couple hours to setup a system again from scratch. Not that I've ever had to do this on macOS personally (though I did once on iOS), but if I had, I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.…

> or boot up Linux and have to fight to get a core function like system updates or audio working

How are these issues? Ubuntu has had these sorts of problems sorted for a while now?

Re: Is macOS Becoming Unmaintainable?

#40

Post by Voliokis »

bookmarkable wrote: post #21

I feel for developers on macOS bugs, bloat and unreliability, but for many users, it still works every day for 5 to 7 years without issue, and updates just mean some new emoji are available.

Unless you're on a device that can only be upgraded to 10.13, after which it won't get security updates anymore after 11 is released. Meanwhile, I can still put W10 on 10-12 year old PCs and it'll run fine (if the hardware wasn't particularly terrible even for back then). It might not support some of the latest features, but it works and you're not subject to some arbitrary decision by Microsoft as to whether you're allowed to use W10 or not.
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