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Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

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Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#201

Post by kumarski »

What most of the people in this thread don't realize is the reason that Uber became large?

The smart ones will understand that Uber's entire subversive cross border growth tactic was tracking cops, which is a felony.

They hired Eric Holder to do the clean up job with workplace harassment as the cover story.

Eric Holder is not the best sexual harassment lawyer, he's the best lawyer to go close private backroom deals with Attorney Generals in all 50 states.

Uber not only did this domestically they did it in places abroad too, india etc...

They were able to fly under the radar long enough to circumvent localized taxes.

Medallion holders pay taxes into their locales, Uber does not.

TNC liceneses are a small fraction of the profits generated.

AB5 California Contractor/Employee Policy:

To hire a contractor, businesses must prove worker

a) is free from the company’s control

b) doing non core/critical work to co

c) has an ind. business in that industry.

Must meet all 3 or be classified as employees.

The lack of property taxes, more pension fund shortfalls, etc... means that California is racing to collect taxes.

The first levers are things like weird fees on receipts, then it moves to applying payroll logic and taxes to businesses (employee vs. contractor), then to wealth taxes, and then the real big kahuna is the VAT taxes.

The VAT taxes are coming.

Taxi cab drivers were middle class and medallion ownership created wealth.

Uber exploits its contractors, operates at a loss, and is propped up by political nepotism and cheap laundered CCP cash.

David Plouffe's job was to run an astroturfing campaign in every major city.

He had trouble written all over him. https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-david-plouff...

Uber is a revolving door of corruption at the highest levels.

Uber circumvented taxes in every city they approached by bribing the State with TNC's and hiring from the revolving door.

People don't talk about all the thug life things Uber did to grow.

I always call BS whenever some Uber shirt tucker comes my way and says "marketplace dynamics" and "intelligent routing."

Uber is an amoral company that built political firewalls against regulatory realities, not one of brilliant technologists.

Also, here's me with $50k in uber credits: https://twitter.com/datarade/status/1080608107409993728?s=20

It took me several years to figure out the subversive truths of Uber that made it large.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#203

Post by cltby »

throwawaygh wrote: post #155
lovich wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can want a social safety net and also be upset at the free rider problem

You can also not want a social safety net and also be upset at the free rider problem. Unless you’re living off returns on capital, your tax dollars and your children’s future tax dollars are keeping Uber/Lyft independent contractors fed and off the streets. I’m not sure why you’d be more angry at people who don’t want to see homelessness/hunger than at people who are pocketing everything in good times and peaking ou…

Ok I'll bite. Can you point me to something that shows that rideshare drivers would be hungry and homeless were it not for progressive generosity? Literally any sign that they disproportionately rely on public assistance? And to the extent they do, which they don't, did Uber and Lyft create that situation?

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#204

Post by all_blue_chucks »

usaar333 wrote: post #170
all_blue_chucks wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should all care. Uber doesn't provide health insurance. Instead Uber drivers get their healthcare costs covered by the rest of us (either via ACA subsidies or written-off care provided to the uninsured).

Making them employees doesn't give them health insurance. Only if they work over 30 hours a week, which Uber is highly incentived to cap. Besides, what you are actually stating is that Uber riders should pay for Uber driver's health insurance, rather than the general population.

Correct. Uber drivers should play by the same health insurance rules as other workers. And under today's laws that requires they become employees.

Ideally health insurance should be decoupled from employment status, but until then, we should all play by the same rules.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#205

Post by throwawaygh »

chrischen wrote: post #181
throwawaygh wrote: post #72

When companies like Uber/Lyft depend on safety nets like unemployment without ever paying into the system, what’s happening is that our children are paying for returns on VC capital. People profiting from these types of companies should feel bad about themselves.

Actually what happens is we get lower Uber/Lyft rates for consumers... consumers that may depend on it in low infrastructure areas such as other low income workers. In a competitive market there is no such thing as “free profit” for companies. Most savings that apply to all market competition across the board transfer to lower prices in the general market. Uber would only net the profit if for some reason it was the…

And, if those other people did it, then I would be saying this about them.

“That’s how the world works” is the oldest justification for injustice.

If capitalism really is just a spreadsheet feudalism that deprives even the yacht owners of human moral autonomy, then maybe it’s time to burn down the system. NB: I don’t buy it, and I think markets can function alongside patriotic responsibility.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#206

Post by Spivak »

dcftoapv wrote: post #124
cltby wrote: post #111

> Seems like a loss for everyone except bureaucrats Not true, it's a great opportunity for javascript developers to get up on their soap boxes and share with us their moral and economic wisdom.

Pot meet kettle

Poking fun at your own ingroup is the joke.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#207

Post by Skunkleton »

ram_rar wrote: post #80
ccktlmazeltov wrote: post #71

This is all a shit show because the infrastructures in place are currently doomed for the market to succeed: - no healthcare means you're a slave of whatever you can find, - tipping culture means your employer can pay you shit

+1 for tipping culture. I just dont get it, why can employers pay their fair share, instead of expecting customers to foot the bill.

> instead of expecting customers to foot the bill.

Either way, the customer will be paying this bill.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#208

Post by [deleted] »

haberman wrote: post #195
shanemhansen wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's lots of ways to lie with surveys, I wonder what the exact wording was and what the responses would be to variants such as: 1. Do you want to be CEO of your own company or a peon employee? 2. Do you want uber to set your hours? 3. Do you want medical, vacation days, or unemployment insurance? For some people these are all basically the same questions. For most folks, I don't think they are.

> When we polled drivers about their preference between remaining an independent contractor or becoming an employee, an overwhelming number of drivers wanted to remain independent. > "What type of employment relationship would you like to have with rideshare companies" > (A) I don't know the difference: 3.3% > (B) I'd like to be an employee: 20.8% > (C) I'd like to be an independent contractor: 75.9% https://therides…

[deleted]

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#210

Post by Consultant32452 »

serjester wrote: post #99

Completely anecdotal but I bring this question up every time I drive in an Uber and overwhelmingly the drivers tell me they want to stay independent. No one is forcing drivers into their jobs. I really struggle to understand why we need bureaucrats imposing their idea of what a market should look like on an fairly efficient market. From my experience the drivers are perfectly aware of the costs that go into driving s…

I feel like there is a general pattern. The left tends to prioritize all the good ideas: gender equality, racial equality, income gaps, etc. The right tends to prioritize systems that actually function in the real world with real people who are sometimes jealous, stupid, unethical, liars, etc. This is just a case where the first group has run amok without talking to the second group. It's the good idea of everyone should have good benefits without taking the time to design a system that actually works in the real world.

You actually see this sort of dynamic in startups where you have two people at the top. One is the creative one who pushes all the boundaries and stuff. The other person is the more pencil pusher/lawyer/business type who makes sure the bills get paid on time.

Lots of good things happen when you can get these two types working together instead of hating each other.

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