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Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

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Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#251
post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To play devil's advocate, even if they wanted to follow the law in good faith, they'd need to completely restructure their business. Until they can do so, they'd need to be shut down.

To play devils advocate on your devils advocate, you used Uber and "good faith" in the same sentence, which they definitely haven't earned.

I read the parent's emphasis in "even if they wanted to follow the law in good faith" on even. It's quite possible they agree and meant:

I don't think they want to follow the law in good faith, but even if they did, they'd have to shut down while they restructure to accommodate the law, so this outcome doesn't tell us much about their thinking yet.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have tried, but the aforementioned political party blocked such efforts at the state level in the past, and currently federal law (again, due to that same political party) requires the state to get permission from the federal government to implement a single-payer healthcare system. However, as currently envisioned, the single-payer system would not charge employers; it would be part of the taxes levied on all t…

Do Californians get a lot of benefit for the high taxes they currently pay? Californians seem to be voting with their feet, moving to lower tax states: https://www.ocregister.com/2019/10/31/190122-more-people-lef... Do you feel strongly that one more tax would solve all of California's problems?

Most of the people leaving CA were of the far-right political persuasion, so good riddance to them. And generally, CA is already overpopulated for the amount of housing currently available (or constructable within the near future), so having fewer people actually relieves a lot of the overusage issues currently plaguing many of the public services in CA.

With specific respect to the tax issue, the flipside of "one more tax" to pay for a single-payer system is that it would replace health insurance premiums. Because premiums are currently set for smaller risk sharing pools than a statewide pool of nearly 40 million, and those premiums must also include significant profit margins to pay for health executive's multimillion dollar annual bonuses, it would be very easy for a single-payer tax levy to undercut premiums by more than 50% (and for the single-payer proposals currently under consideration, the employee savings range from 50-90%).

If anything, the problem with a tax for a single-payer health system is that people would be saving so much money compared to paying health insurance premiums that CA would have too many people moving into the state for the rest of our public services to handle.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#253
post #237

I work at Uber outside of the rides/eats business and observed many feature releases to adjust the business after AB5. What I saw released: - Enabling drivers to see where a rider is going before accepting the trip [0] [2] - Removed a main penalty for declining rides, “No More 85% Acceptance Rate Requirement For Uber Pro” [2] - Drivers get set their own fare with a multiplier [1] (the article details screenshots and…

Ridiculous that it takes a legal battle for Uber to offer these customer and driver friendly features

In what world is enabling drivers to see where a rider is going before accepting the trip, or removing requirements for Uber Pro, or removing features from the loyalty program, or removing upfront pricing, or removing the ability for customers to have favorite drivers "customer friendly"?

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#254
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The corruption here is incredible - the taxi cab industry had insurance of like $20K per accident (talk to the women who got brain damage), would never pickup in bad areas AND paid their workers as.... independent contractors!! You think your taxi driver is a W2 employee - please think again. The number of carve outs in this new "principled" rule is incredible, and more industries keep asking for them (freelance writ…

What are the taxis doing with AB 5 then?

>would never pickup in bad areas

They have more control so they are more likely to be considered actual contractors.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#255
post #199
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a bad law - if Uber can't operate in compliance with it, it has a bad business model.

AB5 has not achieved its intended effect and has had a number of unintended consequences, including collateral damage in industries such as freelance journalism and other contract jobs where "full-time" employment results in the employer going bankrupt. Being familiar with some of these industries, I estimate that AB5 has led to a net loss of jobs, economic activity, and civic engagement in CA, again without achievin…

This is akin to saying the Fair Labor Standards Act was a "bad law" because it ended child labor, which I'm sure also caused a temporary "net loss of jobs, economic activity, and civic engagement"

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally agree on the root cause here. Curious though - can California deal with this by offering some a state-level single-payer benefit and charging employers? That would be a broader solution that would address many things in one swoop.

They have tried, but the aforementioned political party blocked such efforts at the state level in the past, and currently federal law (again, due to that same political party) requires the state to get permission from the federal government to implement a single-payer healthcare system. However, as currently envisioned, the single-payer system would not charge employers; it would be part of the taxes levied on all t…

That’s a disingenuous take on it.

CA could fix it’s own health system to cover everyone. Yes, there are federal rules they’d need to work around, but they could do it.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/25/business/economy/californ...

Basically, one someone tallied up the cost, it ran out of steam. Just like in VT.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#257
A couple points here: Uber/Lyft are 100% better than taxi services in every way. You might get a bad driver, but I've never had a bottle of piss hit me in the feet in a ride share. Also, try not paying cash in a Philadelphia taxi. I've had a wheel fall off a cab while I was in it, zero recourse. Rear ended accident, same. Told to pound sand with the PPA. Anecdata, sure, but about ten years of it.

Taxis still exist, with no benefits, still pulling 60+ hours, as an entrenched monopoly via medallion systems. This is sort of a from of driver share cropping, and is equally if not more exploitative.

If CA wanted to regulate it, they could use the data from ride shares and create limits etc. Instead, they're going to put them to pasture.

As for them operating illegally, it is a better system and more efficient than cab services. Sharing rides alone is a multiplier for gas, and app routing is a better system that taxis refused to implement for the longest time, "getting lost" to pump up fares.

If taxis disappeared tomorrow, I would shed zero tears.

Is uber a good company? No, they are a giant capital fueled destroyer. They went toe to toe with entrenched cabs and made some changes. Maybe that's what it takes in a hypercapitalist society, I don't know.

I used cabs for a decade coming home from an interstate train commute and would never use one again. I'd rather take the bus, and in Philly that's saying something.

Hope we see more innovation in this space, if not Uber or Lyft, something.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#258

Want to be free to have a random part-time gig you can pick up whenever you want? Nope, do-gooders are going to do-good you into a wage slave job like everyone else.

Tragically, the state has also taken away my right to sell my kidneys for money, just trying to "protect" me. I'm an adult, if I want the money isn't it strictly better than I have the freedom to cash in on my human resources?

I'm an adult, if I want the money isn't it strictly better than I have the freedom to cash in on my human resources?

Yes.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#259

Want to be free to have a random part-time gig you can pick up whenever you want? Nope, do-gooders are going to do-good you into a wage slave job like everyone else.

> wage slave job like everyone else.

Sort of like driving for Uber...?

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#260
post #199
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a bad law - if Uber can't operate in compliance with it, it has a bad business model.

AB5 has not achieved its intended effect and has had a number of unintended consequences, including collateral damage in industries such as freelance journalism and other contract jobs where "full-time" employment results in the employer going bankrupt. Being familiar with some of these industries, I estimate that AB5 has led to a net loss of jobs, economic activity, and civic engagement in CA, again without achievin…

Ending child labour, having a minimum wage, and having the barest minimum of employment safety standards also has a negative impact on economic activity, and bankrupts some employers. [1]

Hell, If our goal was maximizing economic activity at all costs, we'd be rounding up idlers, and putting them to work, involuntarily.

[1] Ones whose business model relies on one of the following:

* Exploitation of children.

* Providing labour-intensive products for less then the cost of keeping a labourer alive, housed, and fed.

* Running machine shops where workers have to juggle chainsaws, while breathing in asbestos dust, and licking radium-coated postage stamps.

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