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Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

hongkongfp.com

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Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#41

Post by contingencies »

yorwba wrote: post #38
rootsudo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great observation, I didn't even notice. Hang Seng Index, https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/28/asia-markets-hong-kongs-new-... Wow.

The Hang Seng Index isn't new. The Hang Seng Tech Index is, but I don't think it contains any companies not part of the broader Hang Seng Index. I have no idea how that is supposed to demonstrate the power of the CCP.

The Hong Kong Stock Exchange has been promoting tech listings for years. Recently they have a range of policies such as easier routes to listing for tech companies than for traditional firms. I would not consider a tech index an artifact of Beijing influence, which has its own domestic tech stocks in Shanghai, Shenzhen, etc.

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#42

Post by robjan »

Johnjonjoan wrote: post #2

When the Hong Kong stock exchange listed a Chinese tech index the other day I realised Hong Kong had completely fallen. The CCP rules Hong Kong in totality now as far as I'm concerned.

Mainland Chinese stocks have been listed on HKEX and even been components of the Hang Seng Index (kind of like our SP500) for a long time. The main reason that there aren't more HK stocks in the tech index is that there aren't really any HK based tech companies listed on our exchange.

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#43

Post by [deleted] »

rkapsoro wrote: post #39
rootsudo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great observation, I didn't even notice. Hang Seng Index, https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/28/asia-markets-hong-kongs-new-... Wow.

Hang Seng itself is an HK company, has been ever since its inception. HSBC has owned a large part of it for a long time, too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hang_Seng_Bank

[deleted]

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#44

Post by mjayhn »

symmitchry wrote: post #24
FooBarWidget wrote: post #3

It is interesting that there was recently a petition asking for people to support the national security law, and that it managed to gather 3 million signatures. For comparison, high estimations on the number of people who went on the streets to protest, was about 2 million. Both numbers are likely to be overestimations, but it seems to show that the Hong Kong people are divided about whether China is good for them, a…

You believe that 3 million 'petition signatures' is even remotely equivalent to 2 million actual protesters marching the street?

I'm really curious how exponential the amount of signatures you'd get for a protest that brought 2 million people together would be. I'd bet it'd be 30m+ easy but I'm doing completely baseless twitter retweet math.

edit: I worded this strangely and tried to recover it, hopefully it makes sense.

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#45

Post by hombre_fatal »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #34
kick wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the point. He's saying that there's no possible way to decisively figure out who does and doesn't live in Hong Kong on Quora; there are a lot of nations interested in influencing what's going on there right now (including US, I might add), and Chinese disinformation campaigns (especially ones where they pretend to be from elsewhere) aren't a new phenomenon. Petitions are bullshit, Quora is bullshit. Look f…

I wonder what you consider valid opinions then. Suppose a foreigner posts a video on Youtube, showing that he's on the street in China, speaking about Hong Kong. Would you say that that is a valid opinion? Also, if we're so skeptical about all sorts of online comments, do you believe I should consider all HN comments about anything political, to be invalid too because they might be disinformation campaigns?

Notice that walking on the streets of China or Hong Kong is still a world different from posting an internet comment or incrementing a mysql column.

Also, yes, we generally are skeptical of political claims online. See this thread and any political discussion on HN. It's why political submissions are usually clusterfucks like this one where every top-level comment is greyed-out and making a strong claim. Or made by someone who registered an account just to post it.

Either way, you are here bringing Quora posts and a petition in into a superhot discussion that demands more. Linking to published opinion pieces from people at ground zero would definitely be more compelling than pointing us to an internet forum where you write your own byline credentials.

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#46

Post by AnimalMuppet »

jakear wrote: post #4
FooBarWidget wrote: post #3

It is interesting that there was recently a petition asking for people to support the national security law, and that it managed to gather 3 million signatures. For comparison, high estimations on the number of people who went on the streets to protest, was about 2 million. Both numbers are likely to be overestimations, but it seems to show that the Hong Kong people are divided about whether China is good for them, a…

...or the signatures are fake? Petition fraud. Happens in US too, see net neutrality.

Or coerced.

Note that the coercion doesn't have to be blatant or explicit. China said some fairly threatening things about Hong Kong, and some number of residents may have decided that, for their own safety, they needed to signal that they were in support. What they actually feel or think may be different.

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#47

Post by [deleted] »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #46
jakear wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...or the signatures are fake? Petition fraud. Happens in US too, see net neutrality.

Or coerced. Note that the coercion doesn't have to be blatant or explicit. China said some fairly threatening things about Hong Kong, and some number of residents may have decided that, for their own safety, they needed to signal that they were in support. What they actually feel or think may be different.

[deleted]

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#48

Post by FooBarWidget »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #45
FooBarWidget wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what you consider valid opinions then. Suppose a foreigner posts a video on Youtube, showing that he's on the street in China, speaking about Hong Kong. Would you say that that is a valid opinion? Also, if we're so skeptical about all sorts of online comments, do you believe I should consider all HN comments about anything political, to be invalid too because they might be disinformation campaigns?

Notice that walking on the streets of China or Hong Kong is still a world different from posting an internet comment or incrementing a mysql column. Also, yes, we generally are skeptical of political claims online. See this thread and any political discussion on HN. It's why political submissions are usually clusterfucks like this one where every top-level comment is greyed-out and making a strong claim. Or made by s…

Here is an actual person, living in China, commenting on Hong Kong. Do you believe this video deserves skepticism? If so, can you tell me why? https://youtu.be/h64hTb4on78

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#49

Post by snapetom »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #5
FooBarWidget wrote: post #3

It is interesting that there was recently a petition asking for people to support the national security law, and that it managed to gather 3 million signatures. For comparison, high estimations on the number of people who went on the streets to protest, was about 2 million. Both numbers are likely to be overestimations, but it seems to show that the Hong Kong people are divided about whether China is good for them, a…

Does anyone know why my post gets downvoted? Is it not neutral and balanced enough?

In many of your responses, either you completely miss the point of the parent comment, or you're a master of the red herring. Both are obnoxious and will get you downvotes.

Re: Student group leader arrested on suspicion of inciting secession in HK

#50

Post by ponker »

Johnjonjoan wrote: post #2

When the Hong Kong stock exchange listed a Chinese tech index the other day I realised Hong Kong had completely fallen. The CCP rules Hong Kong in totality now as far as I'm concerned.

This was always an inevitability. China could ostensibly take territory from any of its neighbors except Russia. The idea that a small island would be able to stay independent was temporary.
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