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New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

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Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how they would break TLS though. Your ISP cannot just break that up. Maybe degrade your connection to http, but without local access to your machine, it would be quite difficult to inject something in a data stream that is encrypted. Easier to do it through app stores of any kind.

Browsers and operating systems include a list of root certificates which includes those of various governments. Pretty much any government can thus issue valid HTTPS certificates for any domain to MITM traffic.

Part of dns actually prevents that. So long as you are using a browser that has implemented its use, dnd entries specifify the public signing key of the destination server, so if the browser receives a packet signed using a different certificate the Browser will prevent you from navigating there.

I know for a fact that Chrome and Firefox have implemented this as standard behavior specifically to prevent this kind of man in the middle attack, and have explicitly come out against previous government attempts to subvert this guarantee of privacy.

The biggest problem isn't that your own government might swap that orange you wanted for an apple, it's that by making it possible they also make it possible for a foreign government to do so, and they're likely to replace the orange with cyanide.

The US government has tried and failed to push this kind of idiocy through every other year for the last 2 decades. Every major tech company tells them they will flat out refuse to compromise everyone's safety to accommodate idiocy and the attempt is ultimately dropped.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#232
post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, everyone happily shovels all of their data, as well as all of the data their customers provide them, into AWS, which is very cosy with the US military. You can be reasonably certain that anything in AWS is available to US military intelligence without judicial oversight.

Every American service and product needs to be treated as compromised, it really comes down to that. Individual companies now need to earn back basic trust. This doesn't mean you have to completely abandon your favourite service, just have to modify the way you utilize it. For example, if you absolutely have to use Google Drive, be sure to encrypt your files with appropriate strength first and assume they are activel…

>American

Why single out America, Snowden's leaks showed the entire Anglo-sphere is compromised(Five Eyes). Is there any reason to think this isn't the case in any NATO/OECD/etc. country?

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#233
post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how they would break TLS though. Your ISP cannot just break that up. Maybe degrade your connection to http, but without local access to your machine, it would be quite difficult to inject something in a data stream that is encrypted. Easier to do it through app stores of any kind.

Besides, for any malicious interference with updates you will be breaking code-signing on those updates.

You assume they wouldn't just get a warrant to get their binary signed.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#234
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question is rather: can they use preestablished structures and machinery or do they need to build it from the ground up. Surveilance also needs work, and its less work if everything is prepared.

my point was more: any liberal social democratic society that subjects itself to every increasing censorship and surveillance will devolve towards totalitarianism.

Can you explain surveillance leads to totalitarianism? It's not obvious to me.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#235
post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hilarious and schizoid are adjectives that I would assign to your post. Sorry but you are rude. > I think we can safely assume that no Ex-Nazi personnel is currently working at the German secret service Stasi personel though? Are you expecting that people using such nuanced and subtle techniques like Zersetzung against domestic population [1] will suddently become ethical towards anyone they perceive as threat? or…

> Sorry but you are rude. Yes, you are right. I apologize, I clearly went overboard. > Stasi personel though? [...] I think it's just an over-generalization. Just because you worked for the Stasi automatically makes you a bad fit for a certain job. It really depends.

>Just because you worked for the Stasi automatically makes you a bad fit for a certain job.

I am sorry, I am from Russia initially, the KGB-land. No, it's not an over-generalization.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#236
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my point was more: any liberal social democratic society that subjects itself to every increasing censorship and surveillance will devolve towards totalitarianism.

Can you explain surveillance leads to totalitarianism? It's not obvious to me.

Totalitarianism has been the mode of human governance since prehistory. It's great, effective, and always tempting. The Western world today is the exception, not the rule.

It's also really hard to establish or continue without the surveillance to detect rebellion and corruption.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#237
Germany already had a law where any security software on your machine = you are a hacker.

At least this time is is simply useless. The secret services are not magicians and the fact that they have access to my home network or the link does not mean that they can do anything spectacular.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#238
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess funding was not a big issue for the CIA...

They are still flush with cash from decades of running cocaine.

people might laugh at you but Colombian "cartels" have deep ties with the government and the military. They even know the patrolling routes of the US Navy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ra3uSDGL9sw

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#239
post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...internet-printers (Internetausdrucker, a German word for tech illiterates) Let me guess, this word describes people who print out their emails?

Not only mails. I had teachers printing out web pages before reading them because it felt more natural for them.

For serious reading, that does make sense, at least with all monitors I've used so far.

Re: New German law would force ISPs to allow secret service to install trojans

#240
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How's the CSU authoritarian? That's like throwing expletives around; you might as well call them Nazis and get it over with.

It's not. Modern CDU/CSU are basically where the social democrats were about ten years ago.

Spineless, aimless and dysfunctional?
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