Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

theverge.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 870 posts

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#151

Post by the_gastropod »

beaned wrote: post #82
mikepurvis wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At a point which is beyond the confederate flag. There may well be a slippery slope somewhere along this road, but it's not here. Gun advocates resist common sense reforms with the same logic, but lots of military weapons (minigun, flamethrower, rocket launcher, etc) are already either banned or highly regulated and have been for years without anyone's rights having been trampled.

Reminds me of when Trump a while ago (before the recent George Floyd stuff) was commenting on statues being torn down, and commented something like, "next they'll go for George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, where does it end?" John Oliver did a bit on it answering "Somewhere. It ends somewhere," implying that he was an idiot, that it was a stupid comment, and everybody laughed. Now we're here and it has actually h…

Criticism of celebrating deeply flawed men with deeply flawed ideals is not, in any way, erasure. We all know about Nazism and the Holocaust despite the lack of statues of Hitler. Christians somehow know about Satan even though he’s got no statues celebrating his greatness.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#152

Post by ezrast »

pathseeker wrote: post #7

Honest question. For those of you happy that these censorship policies are being implemented by companies in reaction to pressure, do you believe that the ideal end-goal would be 'anti hate speech' laws like those of Germany?

End goal? No. The end goal is eliminating oppression, and the ideal is to have strong enough cultural norms around this that specific laws are unnecessary.

A step in the process? Maybe. I don't know if this kind of legal enforcement is the shortest route from here to there in the US. I could be convinced either way.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#153

Post by chc »

cm2187 wrote: post #91
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. It’s apples and oranges. Companies should be free to regulate hate speech on their platforms. The government should not regulate speech in the public domain. The actions of private companies on private property (virtual or otherwise) are an entirely different domain than government intervention. Even if you remove the censorship angle, it can be argued that moderating hate speech is simply good business sense. Pe…

Sure, it might not violate the law. The problem with private companies trying to enforce political opinions and controlling speech on their platform is that it is pretty much the definition of McCathyism. With people losing their job over liking a tweet. I remember when the left was looking at the McCarthy period as a dark page of american history. I am appalled how quickly this went 180 degrees.

I think you might be viewing the situation at too low a resolution. Do you not see any salient differences between a Senator running an inquisition to root out political adversaries, and a social platform forbidding people from threatening other users?

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#154

Post by benologist »

pathseeker wrote: post #7

Honest question. For those of you happy that these censorship policies are being implemented by companies in reaction to pressure, do you believe that the ideal end-goal would be 'anti hate speech' laws like those of Germany?

I think all the prejudice and intolerance in the world is really just bad behavior we need to unlearn and this will be just another tiny little step towards 'detoxifying society'. Hacker News demands we be civil to each other because antagonizing other users has always been superfluous to discussing tech news, if we intend to discuss tech news it is obviously better if the discussion isn't me calling you names. Users intent on antagonizing others have been an unnecessary distraction in multiplayer gaming for many years.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#155

Post by ggreer »

manuelabeledo wrote: post #67
drocer88 wrote: post #31

What next? Tibetan flags? Uighur flags? Palestinian flags? Basque flags? Chechen flags? Israeli flags? South vietnamese flags? Taiwan flags? Dominion of Newfoundland flags? Black nationalist flags? Who's the judge?

It depends. Which ones represent the right of owning dark skinned people? I would be happy if they ban those too.

Before it was invaded by China, Tibet had serfdom and what most would consider to be slavery. Also Tibetan punishment for crimes often involved removal of eyes or amputation of limbs.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serfdom_in_Tibet_controversy#H...

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#156

Post by pfraze »

cm2187 wrote: post #121
happytoexplain wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>it's a pretty slippery slope. I disagree. >Is this a hate symbol? I believe so. >will you also consider whatever other symbol gets co-opted? Yes, if it does get co-opted to the extent of replacing its original meaning. Luckily that only happens rarely. That's just how symbols and communication work - it's an unfortunate and unavoidable reality. The swastika is the most obvious example.

I think a photo of the Che is a hate symbol. It is glorifying a psychopath who killed without a second thought for a genocidal ideology. That's my opinion. So do I get to get it removed everywhere because it offends me?

1. Spend time educating people on why Che doesn't deserve to be idolized 2. Garner support for his removal 3. Go to any company using or selling his image and use your support to have it removed

You asked how it works, that's how it works

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#157

Post by 1123581321 »

gentleman11 wrote: post #145
1123581321 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was similar in some ways to the unification conflicts happening in Europe in the 19th century. The contentious issues, slavery and tariffs, forced a disagreement about the nature of the Union. There was not a shared sense of identity across the United States, so when Virginia, for example, seceded, Virginians sided with their state. Generally, only the more cosmopolitan upper classes felt conflict between a duty t…

Any particular account you would recommend?

McPherson’s Battle Cry of Freedom is a great introduction. Grant published his memoirs and they are highly readable.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#158

Post by magnusmagnusson »

happytoexplain wrote: post #112
magnusmagnusson wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"This slope isn't particularly sloppy" is the single best reply capturing the delusion and dishonesty of the people who celebrate the limiting of speech and expression heere. At least admit it proudly, that you are placing a punishment on vocalbulary and imposing self-censorship and thus invading privacy too. All these masks attempting to cover-up reduction of politics to friend/enemy distinction are even more insult…

Frankly, I consider this position to contribute much more greatly to the "reduction of politics to friend/enemy distinction" than any of the comments you're referring to. If a symbol of hatred is banned on a private platform and you consider that an attack on your politics, that makes it borderline impossible to believe that you are arguing in good faith.

"A symbol of hatred", the U.S. flag appears to be the choppin block since the Union boys were selling 'free'd' blacks c. 1870.

All I ask of the people who are against these historical symbols is that they wear their power proudly without such lame constructs as "hate speech".

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#159

Post by kube-system »

happytoexplain wrote: post #48
ta17711771 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By the government!?

By the people, via the government, as all government action is theoretically supposed to be.

Government only remains "by the people" if the people maintain the ability to exercise effective oversight over it. Speech is an effective means of exercising government oversight, which is why marginally increasing government power to suppress it is so contentious.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#160

Post by s9w »

searchableguy wrote: post #99
s9w wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very soon even Facebook likes will be illegal in Germany if it's the "wrong" ones by the way. That law passed a week ago or two.

Explain which law are you referring to here?

A politicians who told Germans to leave their country was killed. That was taken as a welcome opportunity to turn things to 11. There is now another new law "zur Bekämpfung des Rechtsextremismus und der Hasskriminalität".

> "Dabei reicht dann auch schon, dass man als Gleichgesinnter auftritt und solche Inhalte teilt oder mit einem "Gefällt mir" versieht"

https://www.pcgameshardware.de/Internet-Thema-34041/News/Bun...

Post reply on HN