An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT • Hacker News Board

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#161

Post by p_l » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:17 PM UTC

SkyBelow wrote: post #141

p_l wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what concentration camp is for. To concentrate and control. There were separate death camps (sometimes combined) that involved direct train-to-killing-field pipelines, and most concentration camps involved work in horrible conditions, but that's because of further goals above relocation.

>That's what concentration camp is for. To concentrate and control. The problem is that these words have taken on entirely different meanings that perhaps what they once meant and there are those who take advantage of that disparity. When people hear about concentration camps, they think death camps, even if that isn't specifically what the word once meant. There are many such ways to twist words like this and rarely…

The most famous concentration camp was for all practical purposes a combined one (when people talk of Aushwitz they generally conflate a pretty big complex of camps together).

It doesn't change the part where concentration camps were modeled after British and US approaches of dealing with "undesirables"

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#162

Post by api » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:17 PM UTC

I wonder how the 4chan crowd feels about helping "meme Trump into office?"

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#163

Post by api » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:19 PM UTC

alkonaut wrote: post #117

> (R-SC)...(R-AR)...(R-TN) It's funny how you can read just that and know that the bill is going to be absurdly bad. Not even just bad in the philosophical/political sense but actually just bad as in not understanding the problem space, or not even formulated clearly or coherently.

Nancy Pelosi backed EARN-IT, a bill that's just a more passive aggressive way to try to get the same camel into the same tent.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#164

Post by monocasa » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:21 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #145

redis_mlc wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> we had concentration camps for Japanese people during World War II I study WW2, and it's important to be factual. The correct term is internment camps. Japanese-Americans usually lost their property, but the purpose was to locate them in central locations, not to re-educate or liquidate them, as our enemies did to the Allies. For that time in history, it could be argued that the decision made sense. Japanese subs d…

> using the term "moral high ground" is not helpful for a number of reasons The U.S. had a global nuclear monopoly for several years. It didn’t abuse it. That’s a hell of a high ground.

The US is the only country to have used nuclear bombs in anger, and that was during it's nuclear monopoly.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#165

Post by mjburgess » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:21 PM UTC

bluescarni wrote: post #123

mjburgess wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

wtf are you talking about? Half a million Italians died in WW1. And as many again from the spanish flu. And all of Europe was in a permanent condition of poverty until way into the 20th C. 80% of the population was poor working class even in 1970. You do not get Russian communism without the prolonged period of slavery called "serfdom" which persisted into the late 19th C. in russia. You do not get fascism in italy w…

The Italian deaths in WW1 were overwhelmingly soldier deaths, as the fighting on Italian soil was limited to north-east border of the country (where incidentally I am from). The civilian population was largely unaffected by the war. > And as many again from the spanish flu. Who talked about flu? You were talking about WW1, now you are pivoting to the flu? > And all of Europe was in a permanent condition of poverty un…

WW1 was a total war. Fascism was a response to total war which conscripted every civilian into the military. Italy did not have an army of 500,000 soliders before WW1, no country did. The british empire's armed force was 80,000 -- and was one of the largest in the world. Where do you think 500,000 "soliders" came from? They were drafted from the population.

It's literally in the first paragraph in the wikipedia article on fascism...

> Fascists saw World War I as a revolution that brought massive changes to the nature of war, society, the state, and technology. The advent of total war and the total mass mobilization of society had broken down the distinction between civilians and combatants. A "military citizenship" arose in which all citizens were involved with the military in some manner during the war.

> I suggest you better inform yourself about the 20-th century history of European societies before spouting more nonsense.

I'm British and I know my own history very well. Read any book of the time, "Road to Wigan Peer" will give you the quality of poverty.. and any graph by any serious economic study of human history will give you the actual level of wealth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_World_War_...

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#166

Post by CivBase » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:22 PM UTC

tomcooks wrote: post #72

Please stop voting dumbasses in the US, it affects everyone living in countries who have commercial agreements with then

This might be an unpopular opinion, but I don't think we should encourage people to vote as much as we do. Voting is an opportunity to make your voice heard. If you have nothing to say about the issues facing a particular office, don't vote.

I do not vote for candidates who I am not informed about, but many people do. Those uninformed votes just drown out the voice of the informed voters and reinforce the party-line tribalism that seems to be slowly taking over the nation. In an ideal world, I would be informed about the issues surrounding all of the offices for whom I'm asked to vote. Unfortunately, I simply do not have time to concern myself with more than a handful of offices.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#167

Post by api » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

xedrac wrote: post #153

As someone who typically votes conservative, this is the kind of ignorance that makes me seriously reconsider my stances. This would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and go a long way toward emulating China. No thank you! Time to double down on encryption efforts and Tor usage.

There is plenty of room for a sane, intelligent conservative position in our political landscape and discourse.

Where is it?

There are over a dozen congressional candidates today (all on the R side AFAIK) who espouse or at least dog whistle to the Qanon cult.

Imagine if PETA, Earth First!, and the most unreasonable histrionic "social justice warrior" types took over the Democratic Party. That's where the Republican Party is going if it isn't there already.

Where's Eisenhower or even Reagan?

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#168

Post by superkuh » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:27 PM UTC

api wrote: post #162

I wonder how the 4chan crowd feels about helping "meme Trump into office?"

If you think who is currently president matters one bit when it comes to passing bills increasing federal spying and power then you haven't been paying attention.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#169

Post by x86_64Ubuntu » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:28 PM UTC

schaefer wrote: post #102

I've read the bill of rights. i have a right to be secure in my papers and affects. okay, this bill emphasizes that police need a warrant, but glosses over the bit about actual security . administrative controls aren't security. That's why we haven't outlawed locks on the front door...

Secure in your papers and affects means that they can't just go rifling through them. But if I have a bag in my car, and cops want to search it for drugs or weapons, then that's okay. So we've passed the point of the 4th having any legitimate meaning.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#170

Post by yingw787 » Thu, Jun 25, 2020, 1:30 PM UTC

CivBase wrote: post #166

tomcooks wrote: post #72

Please stop voting dumbasses in the US, it affects everyone living in countries who have commercial agreements with then

This might be an unpopular opinion, but I don't think we should encourage people to vote as much as we do. Voting is an opportunity to make your voice heard. If you have nothing to say about the issues facing a particular office, don't vote. I do not vote for candidates who I am not informed about, but many people do. Those uninformed votes just drown out the voice of the informed voters and reinforce the party-line…

Have you tried absentee voting? It's honestly pretty great. I spend maybe three hours at my computer googling the people I don't know, then send it back.

Not sure if it makes a difference in the end but it's cool to know who's claiming they represent you.