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For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

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Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#241

Post by rsynnott »

mlpgx wrote: post #44
ChuckMcM wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, the discussion of your action here confirms, even more strongly, that not only is the bias real, but also it is sometimes completely opaque to people who hold that bias. Thanks for unflagging it, otherwise I would have missed it I'm sure.

The problem is that everyone has his own personal experiences. In my surroundings I've seen black women get funding where white men did not. I've seen minorities preferred in hiring. The world has changed drastically in the last five years. It is white men who feel silenced in the tech industry, by HR, the press, CEOs and activists. So the article can be true of course, but it aligns less and less with what we see in…

> It is white men who feel silenced in the tech industry, by HR, the press, CEOs and activists.

As a white man, I’m sorry, what? Are you writing from a parallel universe?

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#242

Post by Pfhreak »

Grustaf wrote: post #113
panopticon wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's a stereotype, likely a correct one [snip], and most importantly: not harmful. It's just a stereotype. Citation on those not being harmful? Stereotypes like that seem to be a driving factor in why STEM fields are very male dominated. "Girls don't like cars; go find some dolls to play with."

No normal parent has said anything even remotely like that in the last 30 years. Why is it so terrible to accept that men and women on average have different interests? Everyone knows that testosterone makes young men orders of magnitude more violent, why is it inconceivable that they could also be 4 times more interested in more mechanic play? It’s been observed even in almost newborn chimpanzees for Gods sake.

> No normal parent has said anything even remotely like that in the last 30 years.

You haven't been exposed to a very broad range of parents. I've seen parents who very tightly control which toys, clothes, and grooming choices their kids make because they don't align with the parent's gender expectations. It's frustratingly common in the US.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#243

Post by tqi »

goodoldbiff wrote: post #139
leoc wrote: post #125

Here's a recent Twitter thread by Timothy Jones https://twitter.com/timbeejones/ which seems relevant: https://twitter.com/timbeejones/status/1268665921364770816 . I can't vouch for it as I have zero experience of SV or being black, let alone the specifics here, but the author seems to be someone worth hearing on the subject. Someone always complains about reading Twitter threads, so here's a thread unroll https://th…

Bringing in Biff is what VCs always do. Or at least always used to do. I've encountered it personally. The term they used was "seasoned executive". Biff is a better name. I'm not doubting Timothy's experience, but if he's right, the point would have to be that VCs bring-in-Biff more often with black founders than they do white ones. Which seems entirely plausible, but that's not the argument I think I'm reading here.

Even if they weren't bringing in Biff more often with black founders than white founders, if the pool from which they select Biff is overwhelmingly white men, the effect is still that black founders get pushed aside in favor of white men.

Even if their selection process for Biff was completely gender / race blind, as long as the primary qualification for Biff is "has previously been CEO" then the next generation of companies will continue to inherit the previous generation of companies' demographics.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#244

Post by charlesu »

0zymandias wrote: post #213

It seems like people from other ethnicities/countries have done well in Silicon Valley, e.g. India, China, Iran. Notably, CEOs of Google, Microsoft, Uber and others are brown-skinned. Would they have done even better without the racism? Or what accounts for the difference?

The difference is hundreds of years of slavery and institutional discrimination specifically target toward blacks and all the accompanying cultural baggage. Part of that baggage is a deeply ingrained suggestion that black people are intellectually inferior but innately athletic.

That isn't to say that other ethnic groups don't deal with racism too. But it's different. An African American executive in a suit may be mistaken for being a waiter, but he's unlikely to be asked where he's "really from" like an Asian American.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#245

Post by refurb »

leoc wrote: post #125

Here's a recent Twitter thread by Timothy Jones https://twitter.com/timbeejones/ which seems relevant: https://twitter.com/timbeejones/status/1268665921364770816 . I can't vouch for it as I have zero experience of SV or being black, let alone the specifics here, but the author seems to be someone worth hearing on the subject. Someone always complains about reading Twitter threads, so here's a thread unroll https://th…

There are plenty of stories on the internet of this happening to white CEOs as well. The skills to go from start-up to series A are very different from series B to IPO.

Now that's not to say race wasn't an issue in this particular case. I don't know.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#246

Post by wolco »

nouveaux wrote: post #209
nsporillo wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly are the powers and material structures that contribute to the perceived racism in our society? From my limited understanding of this position, it sounds like the goal is a dismantling of police and courts which form the backbone of a civil rule of law society.

If a publicly traded company is not doing well, the CEO gets canned and no one bats an eye. If one department is not doing well, it's very common to just fire a bunch of people or get rid of the department completely. The idea of "dismantling of police" does not mean we do not offer protection. It just means that the current organization "police" is not providing the services it's customers want. Years of "tweaking"…

Defunding would move those roles from public jobs to private jobs.

In the end the only the rich would have protection. Probably not the best path. For an example see the private police in London. They answer to no one.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#247

Post by refurb »

contemporary343 wrote: post #70
throwaway713 wrote: post #65

Whoa! I didn’t realize Leland Stanford was racist. And blatantly so. Makes you wonder if the university should be renamed.

It's named after his only son, who passed away from Typhoid at 15: https://facts.stanford.edu/about/

There are plenty of statues and a mausoleum for Leland Sr. on campus.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#248

Post by GaryNumanVevo »

greenhatglack wrote: post #160
GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm skeptical about Robin Diangelo, I read her book a few months ago, and it only seems to be an advertisement for her services as an anti-racist instructor. Her entire argument frames race relations within the context of the workplace which is problematic because her approach is coercive, not educational. It's more a guide on "how not to get fired for being racist" than anything. There are much better books for foun…

There's a lot of money to be made in "anti-racism" and "gender-science", especially in tax-heavy countries. No one ever dares to question it, and it's "good" causes that could use some of the workers income. I'll be contrarian and recommend Thomas Sowell's "Black Rednecks and White Liberals" instead.

I'm skeptical of any American "Libertarian" especially when it comes to race. Sowell is a class-reductionist, which would make him a terrible pick for this topic.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#249

Post by bsanr2 »

GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #118
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Her entire argument frames race relations within the context of the workplace which is problematic because her approach is coercive, not educational. It's more a guide on "how not to get fired for being racist" than anything. I admit I only just started reading her book, so can't comment on that, but I would say that's not the takeaway I got from any of the online videos or interviews I've seen of her, most definit…

The video you linked espouses the same ideas. To be anti-racist isn't to simply understand the things one can and cannot say. To be anti-racist is to fundamentally understand the lived experiences of the Black community and how it relates to other structures of power. It's akin to just memorizing a list of microagressions like curse words and never saying them for fear of being fired. Anti-racism provides the tools t…

Baldwin said that the only way for a black American to know the racist or anti-racist stance of white America is by the state of their institutions. There is something to be said, from our perspective, for people simply exemplifying anti-racist behavior, because I can never know what's truly in your heart; I can only know you by what you do.

If you learn anti-racist behavior and perform it only to manipulate, eventually you're caught, with ramifications for your life or your legacy.

In any case, white America certainly needs to try to understand black America better, but also of great importance is that they begin to understand themselves better. Their history (e.g., "The Lost Cause" is a myth), their personal and communal psychology (e.g., white fragility and guilt), and their behavior (e.g., white flight and opportunity hoarding); and to square that with what they claim are their higher ideals.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#250

Post by [deleted] »

GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #234
lesstenseflow wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To be anti-racist is to fundamentally understand the lived experiences of the Black community and how it relates to other structures of power. I thought “fundamentally understanding the lived experiences of the black community” was impossible for non-black people. What white person has achieved this goal? If none, is it impossible for a white person to be “anti-racist?” I acknowledge racism is a real issue but thin…

Fundamental being the key operative here. Understanding the Black lived experience is an approximation of the actual experience. Of course there's no singular Black experience, but there are fundamentals underlying all, which can be understood and approximated by people with non-Black lived experiences.

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