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ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

ulx3s.github.io

41–50 of 85 posts

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#41
post #25

How does it compare to the Arty A7 for $129?

The question is rather, How does it compare to the Qmtech Wukong board? And the answer is: you get way more bang for your buck with the Wukong board. No Symbiflow, though, if that's what you're after.

Link to board: https://aliexpress.com/item/4000170042795.html

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#42
post #33

very impressive project, its a good time to get into fpga projects

It's much better than before, but it's still surprisingly difficult to buy a cheap (good) FPGA board. For example, the cheapest ECP5 on digikey (FPGA's go for a lot less than list if you're buying more than a few) is about $10 yet the cheapest proper development board is a lot more. The FPGA manufacturers like the margins, fine, but I'm surprised people who make boards like this one but for other things don't just ch…

Qmtech on Aliexpress have the best price/performance when it comes to FPGA boards.

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#44

Is there any published rationale for the RISC-V instruction encoding? A few months back I set out to write a software emulator of RISC-V for fun. I expected the instruction set encoding to lend itself well to a very simple implementation, eg. something you could decode in 5-10 lines of C plus some tables. But the instruction encoding is much more irregular than I expected: https://github.com/ucb-bar/riscv-sodor/blob/…

Being "simple" for a C program to decode is not the point; generating the smallest hardware to decode instructions and to reduce the critical path for things like deducing the instruction operands are.

For example, the operands all stay in the same position, which prevents putting decode on the critical path before you can figure out which registers you need to read (which is doubly important for superscalar designs which need to compute the register dependence graph). Likewise, the sign-extend bit for immediates is always in the same place, providing relief for another potential critical path.

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#45

Is there any published rationale for the RISC-V instruction encoding? A few months back I set out to write a software emulator of RISC-V for fun. I expected the instruction set encoding to lend itself well to a very simple implementation, eg. something you could decode in 5-10 lines of C plus some tables. But the instruction encoding is much more irregular than I expected: https://github.com/ucb-bar/riscv-sodor/blob/…

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Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#46

Is there any published rationale for the RISC-V instruction encoding? A few months back I set out to write a software emulator of RISC-V for fun. I expected the instruction set encoding to lend itself well to a very simple implementation, eg. something you could decode in 5-10 lines of C plus some tables. But the instruction encoding is much more irregular than I expected: https://github.com/ucb-bar/riscv-sodor/blob/…

I'm not sure about publications that try to answer "why RISC-V?", but the specification often describes the rationales behind many of these kinds of decisions. The bit patterns are often designed to make it easier to write efficient hardware designs to implement them. For example, if an instruction encodes an "immediate" value, the most significant bit of the instruction will always hold that value's sign-extension b…

Also, to the specific "0b1100011 in the lowest bits" question, page 8 of the spec shows that, for an instruction to be 32 bits, the lowest two bits must be 11 (non-11 is used for 16-bit) and the next three bits must not all be 111 (111 is used for 48-bit and larger instructions).

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intel Stratix 10

Can you say more about why this one is the one? Is it better in quantitative ways or ease of use than competitors? Cheaper or more reliable? Etc

Stratix 10 is an absolutely enormous FPGA (10FLOPS) so I'm guessing wow-factor rather than ease of use.

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have open-source UEFI and openfirmware implementations already; is it really any more complicated then porting one and populating what I understand to be fairly standard interfaces for exposing device information to the operating system? Like... I'm sure it's not actually that easy, but what's the hard part once you've got working code execution from anyting resembling a normal compile chain?

I suspect GPU / display controller and associated licensing and patents are an even bigger obstacle.

Quite possibly; I only intended to comment on booting/firmware issues. It depends on your goal, too; I'd be quite happy to see RISC-V servers (headless) and desktops (separate video card). Basically, give me a 100% libre SoC/CPU+motherboard and I'm personally happy to worry about the rest later. Also depending on your specific goals and ideology, there's no reason you couldn't make a RISC-PI that just licensed a proprietary video core; that'd still make you more open-source than today's Pi, which has a proprietary CPU and GPU.

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#49
post #21

Layman question: how many years before we get RISC-V desktops or Raspberry Pi like computers?

Desktops, perhaps never - 10 years? Alibaba seem to be funding some R&D in this direction, but I'm not too familiar (and I can't speak Chinese). It's certainly possible, but desktop processors aren't simple in any way. Regardless of absolute technical excellence, RISC-V only has to be better than ARM (in both specification and implementation, and cost, of course) which will be a moving target as RISC-V improves. Sing…

> ... https://www.sifive.com/boards/hifive-unleashed this seems to fit the bill. However, they don't seem to be selling those yet ...

The HiFive Unleashed was released (and for sale) back in 2018. From memory, there was a limited run (priced at US$1k each), as it was targeted to specific types of developers looking to do further work improving the platform.

For example, Red Hat bought some and used them for improving the RISC-V support in Fedora. From memory, Richard Jones (@rwmj here on HN) was involved with it.

Re: ULX3S: Hackable FPGA that runs Linux on RISC-V

#50
post #21

Layman question: how many years before we get RISC-V desktops or Raspberry Pi like computers?

Desktops, perhaps never - 10 years? Alibaba seem to be funding some R&D in this direction, but I'm not too familiar (and I can't speak Chinese). It's certainly possible, but desktop processors aren't simple in any way. Regardless of absolute technical excellence, RISC-V only has to be better than ARM (in both specification and implementation, and cost, of course) which will be a moving target as RISC-V improves. Sing…

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