Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

cybernews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 182 posts

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#71

Post by goatinaboat »

Jah6Aihe wrote: post #9

Here is what I do myself to avoid surveillance culture, in case anyone find it useful. 1. I always use local apps rather than webservices if possible. I use only free software, built from source, to be sure there's no tracker in it (I would love to find a way to whitelist which apps can access the network, but I haven't found a way for that yet). There's almost always a way to perform a task locally. 2. I have a copy…

I would love to find a way to whitelist which apps can access the network, but I haven't found a way for that yet

Ironically this is very easy on W10 and OSX. But you can do it on Linux with AppArmor.

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#72

Post by rickmode »

shadowgovt wrote: post #50
BLKNSLVR wrote: post #10

So the US, with its Constitution protecting the people from its Government, is allowing this whilst also considering Edward Snowden a traitor? It seems something has shifted 180 degrees since WW2, and the US Government has quietly won the game where the goal was to shit on the entirety of the history upon which it was built whilst, at precisely the same time, pointing to the Constitution as the reason why "America is…

> It seems something has shifted 180 degrees since WW2 The Twin Towers were destroyed, the Pentagon was damaged, and an additional plane was crashed, via a successful conspiracy that could have been detected by blanket, passive surveillance. That's what changed. The threat model the US defense department is concerned about has changed significantly since WWII. The threat to Pax Americana is not direct military interv…

I don't think this is a good example.

If memory serves, the threat _was_ detected, however it was not acted on. There was lots of finger pointing about lack of coordination, but (as I recall) the core problem was that it was one threat amount many (100s? 1000s?), so the threat detection was generating too much noise.

Ubiquitous surveillance could (does) easily end up creating the same situation: not enough signal among the noise.

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#73

Post by shadowgovt »

malandrew wrote: post #62
shadowgovt wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems something has shifted 180 degrees since WW2 The Twin Towers were destroyed, the Pentagon was damaged, and an additional plane was crashed, via a successful conspiracy that could have been detected by blanket, passive surveillance. That's what changed. The threat model the US defense department is concerned about has changed significantly since WWII. The threat to Pax Americana is not direct military interv…

I wouldn't even say it is just the threat model that changed. Humans in developed markets now have a very unhealthy relationship with death to the point where any policy that minimizes death is acceptable consequences be damned. We no longer see death as a normal and natural part of life like previous generations did because it's not as prevalent as it once was. The threat model you just described in another era woul…

I don't think I can point to an era in US history where an attack on a couple buildings resulting in thousands dead would have been brushed under the rug as "Well, death just happens." I'd even argue that's not a healthy response to a human-caused tragedy like that.

Seeing death as normal and natural carries its own antisocial pathologies. War is more justifiable if "Everyone has to die some time."

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#74

Post by tsukurimashou »

fsflover wrote: post #27
Jah6Aihe wrote: post #9

Here is what I do myself to avoid surveillance culture, in case anyone find it useful. 1. I always use local apps rather than webservices if possible. I use only free software, built from source, to be sure there's no tracker in it (I would love to find a way to whitelist which apps can access the network, but I haven't found a way for that yet). There's almost always a way to perform a task locally. 2. I have a copy…

I wonder which OS you are using. I would definitely recommend Qubes OS from what you wrote.

He uses TempleOS of course

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#75

Post by shadowgovt »

rickmode wrote: post #72
shadowgovt wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems something has shifted 180 degrees since WW2 The Twin Towers were destroyed, the Pentagon was damaged, and an additional plane was crashed, via a successful conspiracy that could have been detected by blanket, passive surveillance. That's what changed. The threat model the US defense department is concerned about has changed significantly since WWII. The threat to Pax Americana is not direct military interv…

I don't think this is a good example. If memory serves, the threat _was_ detected, however it was not acted on. There was lots of finger pointing about lack of coordination, but (as I recall) the core problem was that it was one threat amount many (100s? 1000s?), so the threat detection was generating too much noise. Ubiquitous surveillance could (does) easily end up creating the same situation: not enough signal amo…

It's not an example; it's the causal explanation.

The article in question at the top of this thread is discussing the Patriot Act expansion; the family of laws passed in direct response to the attacks of 2001.

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#76

Post by nabnob »

jimbob45 wrote: post #28
LarryDarrell wrote: post #11

I can't even imagine how muted the Civil Rights era would have been had the FBI had this power back then.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI%E2%80%93King_suicide_lette... Let's not pretend that things are materially worse than they were back then. We certainly aren't blackmailing civil rights leaders into suicide anymore within the FBI.

That's actually not true, and that's a really big assumption to make without evidence or direct experience.

Radical activists today still face state suppression. I know of a communist in Austin who had an FBI file because he led lots of actions, which (I think) he discovered through FOIA requests. In 2018, the Austin PD colluded with two people who claimed this guy assaulted them while he was armed, which was completely false. He's in prison now.

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#77

Post by winslow »

It's clear that the government(s) haven't had people's interest for quite a while now. It's nice for us to vote and protest but we need to take things into our own hands as those forms have yielded little results.

We need to build things and use software that are privacy first.

Such as:

  DuckDuckGo  
  Firefox  
  Signal (actually secure messaging unlike whatsApp)  
  Linux OS  
  TOR  
  Librem 5, is a great open sourced secure phone example
What are some additional things we should be building or looking to build?

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#78

Post by exclusiv »

RobRivera wrote: post #18
BLKNSLVR wrote: post #10

So the US, with its Constitution protecting the people from its Government, is allowing this whilst also considering Edward Snowden a traitor? It seems something has shifted 180 degrees since WW2, and the US Government has quietly won the game where the goal was to shit on the entirety of the history upon which it was built whilst, at precisely the same time, pointing to the Constitution as the reason why "America is…

>you're fucked I'm sorry but any anecdotal spinning of history and current events supporting a bold claim about the downfall of western society is just outright non scientific, immeasurable, and quite frankly below educated discourse. Now if you have a thesis about the sunset of western hegemony backed by reduced gdp numbers, geopolitical influence, and crime stats, thats a more worthwhile discussion. Call me old fas…

It's just in style to hate on America these days. Been that way for awhile. If you're critical of any other country you get jumped on.

Meanwhile the parent takes an anti-American perspective on the US while finding a way to give China props. Which tells me they are not intellectually honest about what freedom really means or about the injustices that China partakes in.

It's like saying "I don't like that thing you did because I wasn't fully informed of the details or the reasoning. At least China ...."

It's just nonsense from a hater.

Now, we would have actually been fucked a long time ago if we didn't have the Constitution. But it's the best document and framework alive and we'll be fine, despite some challenges to liberty that I don't like either.

What's funny is some non-Western countries have been trying to import their ideals, and having some success with socialism interest, but their own younger people are taking up Western ideals and cultures.

Exporting agendas and propaganda is not feasible in an information age. Many countries are struggling to control their citizens like they used to in the past.

The freer countries will be fine and win out.

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#79

Post by xenospn »

shadowgovt wrote: post #66
tenebrisalietum wrote: post #51

> law enforcement agencies such as the FBI and CIA can continue to look through the browsing history of American citizens without the need for a warrant. I'm always curious what the heck does this mean exactly . - Do they seize your computer and literally copy the browser history from any/all installed browsers? - Do they ask your ISP to pipe DNS requests from your IP to them? - Do they wiretap your line or cellular…

In the case of the laws discussed in this article, the FBI can gain access to the logs of one's ISP (or VPN provider) without a warrant. So they can trace a suspect's TCP traffic without any duty to notify anyone they're doing so.

I'm wondering how that helps them out, exactly? All they see is HTTPS requests to iMessage/Reddit/HN or WhatsApp. They can't look inside the actual payload.

Re: The FBI tracking your browsing history without a warrant might be the beginning

#80

Post by bitxbitxbitcoin »

shadowgovt wrote: post #66
tenebrisalietum wrote: post #51

> law enforcement agencies such as the FBI and CIA can continue to look through the browsing history of American citizens without the need for a warrant. I'm always curious what the heck does this mean exactly . - Do they seize your computer and literally copy the browser history from any/all installed browsers? - Do they ask your ISP to pipe DNS requests from your IP to them? - Do they wiretap your line or cellular…

In the case of the laws discussed in this article, the FBI can gain access to the logs of one's ISP (or VPN provider) without a warrant. So they can trace a suspect's TCP traffic without any duty to notify anyone they're doing so.

That's my reading of it, too. If there are no logs, though the FBI can't get access. [1][2]

Disclaimer: I work for Private Internet Access.

[1]https://torrentfreak.com/private-internet-access-no-logging-... [2] https://www.technadu.com/private-internet-access-wins-agains...

Post reply on HN