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Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

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Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#151

Post by non-entity »

go13 wrote: post #107
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think that the groceries are going to continue to show up on shelves in a world where nobody has to work, reality is going to hand you a very nasty surprise. If we're going to give stuff to everybody, somebody has to make the stuff . Merely redistributing money isn't going to solve that problem.

i thought it was sarcasm, but apparently, based on downvotes, HN is full of left-leaning comrades.

Yes the incredibly libertarian leaning, created by a VC, site is full of leftists.

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#152

Post by dang »

shlom22 wrote: post #91
go13 wrote: post #68

I'm afraid of these socialist trends and statements. Hopefully, there will not be any new "revolution" where 'low-income' will vote for some populist who will make everyone "equal". And by "everyone" they normally mean middle/upper middle class because ultra-wealthy people operate in a bit different world than the rest of people. AND: Can't low earners take those high-earners who work remotely (programmers, for examp…

The West will go full communism, and it will make life better for all of us - no more rent, work or paying for groceries and everything will be taken care of so we can be creative in our time

Can you please not create accounts to break the HN guidelines with? It eventually gets your main account banned as well.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#153

Post by dang »

All: this article deserves a better discussion than it's gotten so far. It's a rare thing: a new angle on one of the absolutely most-discussed topics here. That's interesting, regardless of where our reactions all land on agree/disagree, like/dislike, us/them and so on.

If you're going to add comments to this thread, can you please engage with the specifics of the article?

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#154

Post by neutronicus »

sandworm101 wrote: post #144
nradov wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Node replacement isn't generally a practical option with large machinery or commercial facilities. And even where it could be possible, robots won't be up to the job for many decades. Show me a robot that can extract a badly rusted bolt.

Show me a robot that can FIND a rusty bolt. The act of cleaning, of scrubbing away the dust and dirt from a work area, is beyond AI at the moment. If that rusty bolt has been painted over it might as well not exist.

Shit, and what if it's so badly rusted that you have to drill it out and then use a tap to clear the remaining crud from the threads...

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#155

Post by Red_Leaves_Flyy »

peterwoerner wrote: post #14
Nasrudith wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even more accurate is "most low income jobs" call centers aren't exactly high income. Anyway technically the physical jobs can be done remotely if latency isn't a concern but if it is sufficient to remote work the question usually becomes "Why not do the last 10% and fully automate it?"

Because typically the last 10% incurs 90% of the costs.

The way I've heard it is 90% of the job can be done in 10 hours, the next 9% in 100, the next 0.9% in 1000, the last 0.1% in 10,000 hours

I'd hazard a guess that hours is replaceable with millions of dollars for a rough gauge.

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#156

Post by kthxbye123 »

rkeene2 wrote: post #115
djsumdog wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did Snowden work fully remote as an NSA contractor with classified data?

No. If he did work at home (which is what I'm assuming you mean by "fully remote") on classified material it was not part of his job, and thus if he billed the US Government for that time it would be timecard fraud. If you have knowledge of this, you should report it to DCAA ( https://www.dcaa.mil/ ).

This is the most powerful snitch energy I've ever seen.

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#157

Post by oneiftwo »

Not all work is equally valuable. Not all work is equally doable. Some work requires decades patience and sacrifice before one is competent enough to perform it. Some work is physically or cognitively beyond the vast majority of the population.

It doesn't make sense to expect all jobs to have all the same benefits and privelegdes. Even if we pretend that all humans are fundamentally equal in ability, inequality will always exist, so long as humans are free to make choices in a world of finite resources and time.

Moreso, inequality is not intrinsically bad, for it is a great motivator for the kind of innovation that raises the common floor, which is the more important measure.

If you're able to eat, drink, and shelter during a global pandemic, while your entire country is on lockdown, and your economy has crawled to a standstill, then you're in a pretty good place.

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#158

Post by jokit »

renewiltord wrote: post #138

Equality is not a thing I ever care to have a society optimized for. If you give me a planet, I don't care that everyone else has a galaxy. Simply optimize for the leading edge and the rest will get dragged along.

We should strive for the only equality possible, which is equality in face of the law. There is no other equality. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something.

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#159

Post by BobbyJo »

OldFatCactus wrote: post #61
BobbyJo wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the fact that everyone ended up worse off after, this is kind of a pointless thing to attempt to point out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Revolution#Long-term_im... Just skimming this, it seems the french and the entire world was left better-off actually

Fair enough, but I think we could both agree that the revolution was only beneficial because it changed the old system into something more malleable and predictable. The throne is an unstable thing, as is the man in it, and only subject to change on unpredictable whims.

If you already exist in a system that is pliable, like a democracy, revolution really wouldn't bring you any of the benefits the French revolution did in the centuries that followed. You'd really only get the downsides.

Let's not forget the context of the conversation here an talk about completely different circumstances.

Re: Remote work can also be a source of socioeconomic inequality

#160

Post by WalterBright »

vinniejames wrote: post #137
sandworm101 wrote: post #5

>> "Benefits not available to low-income workers" A more accurate statement would be "Benefits not available to low-income jobs " There are plenty of jobs that simply cannot be done remotely. The more physical the job, the less it can be done remotely. A meat packer at a meat packing plant cannot work from home. A construction worker cannot build houses from a desk. (I'd add nursing, but a large amount of those jobs…

"Pilots cannot pilot from home" ... Google 'drones' "Surgeons can't cut" ... oh but they can, https://www.therobotreport.com/remote-surgery-via-robots-adv... Builders can't build... but they can click "Print" https://www.businessinsider.com/3d-homes-that-take-24-hours-...

> "Pilots cannot pilot from home" ... Google 'drones'

Most of pilot training consists of dealing with emergencies. Pilots tend to be highly motivated to be safe because they hit the ground first. There's a saying among pilots that saving themselves saves the passengers.

I wouldn't get on an airplane with a remote pilot.

BTW, in WW2, bringing the chief of maintenance along for the check ride after an overhaul ensured a quality job was done.

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