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The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

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Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#81

Post by kllrnohj »

toast0 wrote: post #64
derefr wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and then you need to spend 50-100€ to just get boot graphics even though the machine will be headless 99% of the time. Buy a serial-over-USB patch cable; connect it from the NAS to your laptop; open an STTY emulator on the laptop. No boot graphics needed.

Still need something for boot graphics for the BIOS, unless non-server motherboards are coming with serial redirection default enabled and nobody mentioned it.

Set it up with a temporary card and then yank it out after it's setup. You don't tend to access the BIOS that much.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#82

Post by jeffbee »

pedrocr wrote: post #39
gambiting wrote: post #6

So I was recently looking at those as options for a very low budget video editing PC for someone, and yes, AMD destroys intel in raw CPU performance for the same price, however in those low-budget applications Intel has an upper hand - integrated GPU. With AMD you either have to go with the super crappy 3400G, which is a really poor CPU(but also very cheap), or for literally anything else + a dedicated GPU(which incr…

This is really annoying when building a NAS too. Great value CPUs with ECC support make the configurations great and then you need to spend 50-100€ to just get boot graphics even though the machine will be headless 99% of the time. Buying something second hand or from aliexpress defeats the purpose of trying to build something reliable. The market for low-end discrete GPUs has all but vanished thanks to Intel integra…

What about the core i3-8100 with ECC and IGP? The real problem with building a NAS out of these low-end parts is finding the motherboard where ECC actually works. For Ryzen it's roulette, you just have to order one and see if ECC works at all; for Intel you can count on a few vendors but the motherboards cost twice as much as the CPUs and/or have inconvenient shapes.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#83

Post by wffurr »

SomeoneFromCA wrote: post #69
derefr wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could just buy older-gen AMD cards? They still work. Like Apple with their hardware, AMD sees no reason to produce new "value" SKUs, when you can just buy their 1–3-gen-old flagship cards for "value" prices.

Businesses would NEVER buy used cards. The are inefficient in terms of energy consumption, you never know if they were abused for mining and such, no warranty etc.

Parent didn't say "used" at all.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#84

Post by kllrnohj »

bzb3 wrote: post #12
sjwright wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s worth remembering that the PS4 and XB1 consoles both have eight relatively slow x64 cores. Thus any multiplatform titles targeting either of these platforms has to be optimised for many cores and cannot rely on single core performance.

Definitely. But in my case I don't play the last of the last. Most games I play such as world of Warcraft or csgo use old engines and don't take advantage of many cores.

CSGO takes advantage of multiple cores. It starts tapering off at around 4 cores, but it still showed gains all the way up to 6 cores: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fj9cuHuTNVU

It very definitely takes advantage of far more than 1 or 2 cores, though, with 4 cores having ~2x the FPS compared to 2 cores.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#85

Post by pedrocr »

jeffbee wrote: post #82
pedrocr wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really annoying when building a NAS too. Great value CPUs with ECC support make the configurations great and then you need to spend 50-100€ to just get boot graphics even though the machine will be headless 99% of the time. Buying something second hand or from aliexpress defeats the purpose of trying to build something reliable. The market for low-end discrete GPUs has all but vanished thanks to Intel integra…

What about the core i3-8100 with ECC and IGP? The real problem with building a NAS out of these low-end parts is finding the motherboard where ECC actually works. For Ryzen it's roulette, you just have to order one and see if ECC works at all; for Intel you can count on a few vendors but the motherboards cost twice as much as the CPUs and/or have inconvenient shapes.

The point was to use one of these great AMD parts... Motherboard support doesn't seem to be a problem, Asrock lists all their range as supported and has everything you might need. The actual annoying part about motherboards is that some older stuff is technically compatible but you need an old CPU to upgrade the BIOS before you can install one of the newer ones.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#86

Post by morsch »

SomeoneFromCA wrote: post #67
morsch wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PCI Express cards based on NVIDIA GeForce GT 710 are available new for <40 EUR. Presumably there's a large clearance and used market with much lower prices. None of that is an option?

Not everyone is willing to buy old underpowered yet power hungry cards. You'd waste your time searching, you card would'not support 4k and VP9, no warranty. It gets especially expensive if you purchasing machines for some software developing shops - you want to have similar configuration on each machine, to save on IT support.

You're not wrong, the GT 710 only does 4k at <=30 Hz, which makes it a terrible choice for general purpose computing at this point. It also doesn't do VP9 acceleration. The GT 1030 does these things, but it's also twice as expensive.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#87

Post by reaktion »

all_blue_chucks wrote: post #76
reaktion wrote: post #3

I wanted to update my system with the Ryzen 5 1600 AF, given its value at $85 - but it's no longer in stock anywhere at that price, so the 3300X is looking appealing.

Do you find upgrading low end CPUs to be less expensive overall than going straight to mid range CPUs and skipping the upgrade cycle?

I admit that I'm not as concerned with long-term performance for this system. I've managed to stretch a Phenom II 1055T for more than 10 years now - my interest in PC gaming fell off for a while there - so I've already skipped more than a few upgrade cycles!

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#88

Post by zrm »

jdsully wrote: post #15
gambiting wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Many games are pegged to one or two cores only That hasn't been the case for a looong time. But to answer your question, they are much faster than anything from Intel at comparable pricing: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-amd-r... "The results here are immediately interesting. Despite costing less than every other CPU represented, the 3100 manages to tie the Core i5 9600K in single-core perf…

I have a Ryzen 3900X, and also an i5 for software development. With unoptimized code the Ryzen is pretty close to the i5. But when you start to really optimize it becomes obvious the i5 has more execution resources and is faster single threaded.

Most benchmarks show the 3900X with single thread performance competitive with Intel's offerings, including for software whose developers spend plenty of time optimizing it. Can you think of a reason they haven't realized this performance advantage in practice?

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#89

Post by ciupicri »

morsch wrote: post #34
SomeoneFromCA wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$120 is sensitive amount of money for someone who wants to use a machine only for development. I am wondering why AMD would manufacture ultra low end potato cards which would cost like $35, only for office use. That would boost the sales big time.

PCI Express cards based on NVIDIA GeForce GT 710 are available new for <40 EUR. Presumably there's a large clearance and used market with much lower prices. None of that is an option?

Except for a couple of very new cards, most GT 710 cards don't have a DispayPort output, only HDMI. I also wonder if they support HDCP 2.2.

Re: The AMD Ryzen 3 3300X and 3100 CPU Review: A Budget Gaming Bonanza

#90

Post by jdsully »

zrm wrote: post #88
jdsully wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a Ryzen 3900X, and also an i5 for software development. With unoptimized code the Ryzen is pretty close to the i5. But when you start to really optimize it becomes obvious the i5 has more execution resources and is faster single threaded.

Most benchmarks show the 3900X with single thread performance competitive with Intel's offerings, including for software whose developers spend plenty of time optimizing it. Can you think of a reason they haven't realized this performance advantage in practice?

Zen is great if you have moderate utilization code around the ~2-3 instructions per cycle mark. This is common for most compiled C and C++ where it hasn’t been specifically tuned for ILP. In these scenarios even if Intel has an extra ALU it won’t be used anyways.

It took 3 days of tuning to get to a point where Intel started pulling away from my Zen2 chip. No matter what I did the Zen2 would not get faster because it was already at max utilization.

Lemire had a blog [1] talking about this on here a few months ago as well. Most people were surprised because frankly Zen2 is very competitive with Intel for normal compiled code.

https://lemire.me/blog/2019/12/05/instructions-per-cycle-amd...

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