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The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

sfmayor.org

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Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#601

Post by greedo »

rayiner wrote: post #299
hombre_fatal wrote: post #4

I'm lucky enough to have remote work. And I'm sure many HNers have a nice buffer of savings from their tech jobs to weather the storm or are getting paid time off. But can anyone share what it's like to not be in either of these situations? How are your rent lords handling things? I live abroad in a cheap country so I can handle zero income, but I wouldn't be able to last long if rent was $2000+/mo instead of the Yet…

In the US, the third category is being furloughed and collecting unemployment. Here in Maryland, anyone making $55,000 or below collects as much in unemployment (with the $600/week federal supplement) than they did while employed. The IT systems have done a bad job handling some new categories of claimants (people who couldn’t collect unemployment before but were allowed to under the CARES Act). So some people are wa…

Just a mathematical nit; Maryland caps unemployment at $430 per week. So adding CARES bumps that to $1030/week. It's only lasts 26 weeks, so it's worth $26780. I'm not sure if you have to pay income tax on any of this.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#602

Post by noelherrick »

CPLX wrote: post #157
newacct583 wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> shut down nearly all commerce That doesn't seem right. I got tacos from down the street last night. I got paid a week ago. I bought some home office related junk from Amazon yesterday. I need to go shopping tonight. That's the problem with not being specific, you find yourself spouting silly hyperbole instead of argument. No, "almost all commerce" isn't shutdown, that's not remotely true. We're looking, depending o…

> That's the problem with not being specific, you find yourself spouting silly hyperbole instead of argument. No, "almost all commerce" isn't shutdown, that's not remotely true. We're looking, depending on how pessimistic you want to be, at like a 20-30% drop in GDP. And that's big, but it's simply not almost all. You're kidding right? The drop in GDP between 1929 and 1932 was about 15% or so. You're saying I'm the o…

> The drop in GDP between 1929 and 1932 was about 15% or so.

I could be entirely wrong, but I just wonder whether GDP is a good measure or not for this situation. Think about childcare - it's not that children are not being cared for: in fact, they might be getting more attention from their parents or other family members. Yes, the daycare is shut down and not making money, but the work is still performed. Similar to restaurants vs. food made at home.

I wonder if the loss of non-essential businesses is as detrimental to our economy as the loss of essential businesses. During the Depression, we were losing essential businesses like farms and then on top of that we had a dust bowl. The economy feels very squishy - as in, we're able to layoff and furlough an amazing percentage and people still get the basics like food, water, and shelter, and we still have luxury goods: Apple is still releasing new iPhones even though they're made in China, we still have craft beer flowing, and we can get tacos.

Tied into this, though, is that we do have to keep money flowing not through labor, since that's illegal for a lot of folks, but start figuring out better unemployment insurance and small business aid.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#603

Post by ceejayoz »

9nGQluzmnq3M wrote: post #557
lowpro wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My friend who works at the airport in the Galapagos (GPS) was telling me that no one has gotten paid since the tourism stopped. Luckily she can work on farm, but many can't. The local animal shelter there is now out of food, and the dogs will starve if they don't somehow raise money in the next 3 days or so (@patitasgalapaguenas on instagram, you can donate here [0]). The US is struggling in many ways, but I can't he…

Al Jazeera is always a good source for news ignored by the rest of the world. Here's social distancing in a prison in El Salvador -- not sure those masks will help much. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/04/el-salvador-inmates-c... In India in particular, the lockdown has so far caused more misery than the virus itself: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/04/india-covid-19-lockdo... ...although it's an impossible e…

> In India in particular, the lockdown has so far caused more misery than the virus itself...

I mean, that's the point, right?

Heart surgery hurts more than chest pain, but it's intended to prevent the heart attack.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#605

Post by masonic »

collectedparts wrote: post #474
khazhoux wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why "We're in this together" is just not true. Oprah has it better than me right now. But we both have it way better than my hairdresser (who knows if her salon will survive). And all three of us have it better than a Silicon Valley janitor. I'm filled every day with deep, deep sadness for everyone whose refrigerators are running out with their bank account at zero.

Not to be pedantic but "Silicon Valley janitor" (at least if it's for a big enough tech co) _might_ be doing OK. Various tech companies have publicly committed to paying their own hourly staff and subcontracted workers like food service / janitorial at full standard pre-shutdown rates: https://techcrunch.com/2020/03/06/big-tech-commits-to-paying... (Though I have no insight into whether or not they've actually follow…

  Various tech companies
I don't know of a single SV tech company that employs any janitorial staff directly.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#606

Post by therealdrag0 »

holler wrote: post #555
urban_strike wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flowers aren't consumed for survival, i.e. "essential". I'm not sure how intervals of time has any effect on that.

If the flower shop goes out of business, 3-5 ppl lose their jobs. If Costco goes out of business, 250,000 people lose their jobs...

What numbers are these lol? Why compare a single flower shop to all Costco locations including office workers?

There's thousands of flower shops and thousands upon thousands of other shops like flower-shops that have low amounts of foot traffic that make social distancing easy while supporting people's livelihoods.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#607

Post by avalys »

aabhay wrote: post #590
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #577

I hate how the idea of reopening has split down political party lines. This is definitely not the time for partisanship. Now that Republicans have come out as pro-reopening, San Francisco will be the last city to reopen in the country. 0 COVID-19 infections will be too many.

The new order includes several approved low risk activities and transparent indicators that will be used to gauge safety to further reopen. Is there something about this you don’t feel is backed by science?

Do you have a link to this new order?

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#608

Post by arbitrary_name »

holler wrote: post #554
jwlake wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing I'm confused by is why a costco is open that has like 1000 people per day and a flower shop that has 20 customers per day isn't open. Is the flower shop dangerous? Is it less essential on the yearly timeframe? This lockdown isn't measured in days right now, it's measured in months. What's "essential" in days is not what's "essential" in months.

Another thing that I find funny is how haphazardly the social distancing rules are enforced. At Costco when entering the store, they have you get into an external makeshift line and stand 6 feet away from the next person while waiting for your turn to enter the store. BUT, once you enter the store, there's literally not a single person enforcing anything, and so everyone is just mashed together walking around as if n…

Waiting in line means extended contact. Brushing past in an aisle is 'momentary proximity' and while not ideal, represents a lower risk. Also, one is easier to enforce than the other. So there you have it.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#609

Post by holler »

lazyasciiart wrote: post #563
holler wrote: post #548

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was/is the precise reason given, so it's hard to imagine this going on much longer given that hospitals are doing fine. I think another month is going to lead to chaos and many people rebelling.

Ah yes, the argument that protective measures are succeeding and therefore they are no longer necessary. Completely irrational in a scenario where the danger being protected against hadn't gone away.

Where did I "argue" that protective measures are succeeding therefore X? I'm merely stating that you cannot have a society of 350M people completely stop what they're doing for 6 months and not have disastrous consequences. At some point we have to choose whether the lives we're potentially saving after lockdown month X vs the emergent problems from shut down are worth it.

Re: The San Francisco Bay Area shelter-in-place order is being extended through May

#610

Post by holler »

therealdrag0 wrote: post #606
holler wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the flower shop goes out of business, 3-5 ppl lose their jobs. If Costco goes out of business, 250,000 people lose their jobs...

What numbers are these lol? Why compare a single flower shop to all Costco locations including office workers? There's thousands of flower shops and thousands upon thousands of other shops like flower-shops that have low amounts of foot traffic that make social distancing easy while supporting people's livelihoods.

It was a half-assed comment that maybe the Government see's saving Costco as more important than saving the Flower Shop. 95% of what Costco sells is non-essential, yet they are open. There's more at stake. Just a lazy comment though :D
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