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Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

globalhealthnow.org

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Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#141

Post by alexilliamson »

matwood wrote: post #114
nikofeyn wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This crisis is the first event in my lifetime that's given me any optimism about our ability, as a global civilization, to solve problems and get things done. would you mind elaborating? because i find it extremely difficult how one could hold such an optimistic and apparent naive opinion. from where i sit, this crisis is showing the exact opposite. there is very little international communication and cooperation,…

I think you're paying too much attention to Trump and politics. The people actually getting work done are cooperating and moving at a pace that has really never been done. The articles I've read and podcasts I've heard with scientist all echo the same sentiment. Ignore Trump and the politics, the science is happening at a pace unseen before. > the while thing has just been wave after wave of delayed and reactive acti…

> The articles I've read and podcasts I've heard

I share your optimism, but I don't think this bit helps your argument. Podcasts in particular do not scream "credibility"

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#142

Post by tyingq »

lucian1900 wrote: post #134
tyingq wrote: post #86

"Yes. In fact, the Chinese sent 90 tons of plasma to Italy." That's impressive. I wonder how many individual donations that maps to. And how many people that could treat. Edit: Trying to answer my own question. Typical blood donation is 470ml. That weighs about 0.5 kilograms. Plasma is roughly half of what's in your blood, so half that again... 0.25 kilograms. So assuming they meant metric ton (1000Kg), 4000 individu…

Tons of medical supplies have been sent and part of that was plasma. I believe the first shipment was 30 tons in total, but more has been sent since.

Right. The article does say "90 tons of plasma", which is why I tried the math.

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#143

Post by elhudy »

kevingadd wrote: post #78
_bxg1 wrote: post #41

This crisis is the first event in my lifetime that's given me any optimism about our ability, as a global civilization, to solve problems and get things done. I don't feel like we've seen humanity at its best in several decades. Shame it always takes a catastrophe (and an immediate one at that; see climate change) to bring it out.

This crisis has mostly been a massive demonstration of how capitalism undermines society's ability to prevent and cope with disasters. We're seeing individual people show their best while profit motive leads to people sabotaging others' hope of success. A few examples: * A particular politician prioritizing low numbers (to look good) over actual infection reduction * A particular government not issuing orders for nee…

Some of these bullets are a result of shortcomings with democracy not capitalism (or even capitalism by extension of democracy). Whether it's worth giving up democracy in attempt to address these shortcomings, I'm not so sure; seems that would typify a hyperfocus on the bad times.

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#144

Post by SilasX »

znpy wrote: post #139
nikofeyn wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This crisis is the first event in my lifetime that's given me any optimism about our ability, as a global civilization, to solve problems and get things done. would you mind elaborating? because i find it extremely difficult how one could hold such an optimistic and apparent naive opinion. from where i sit, this crisis is showing the exact opposite. there is very little international communication and cooperation,…

> there is very little international communication and cooperation Indeed. The EU didn't really mind about Italy's problems and potential economic unease until it started affecting other european countries too. If you assume the european union being based, fundamentally, on cooperation then that really make you question the whole thing.

Yeah, and you can't really leave things to be some other country's problem -- especially a transmissible disease -- when that country shares a (for the time being) open border with you on land.

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#145

Post by matwood »

alexilliamson wrote: post #141
matwood wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're paying too much attention to Trump and politics. The people actually getting work done are cooperating and moving at a pace that has really never been done. The articles I've read and podcasts I've heard with scientist all echo the same sentiment. Ignore Trump and the politics, the science is happening at a pace unseen before. > the while thing has just been wave after wave of delayed and reactive acti…

> The articles I've read and podcasts I've heard I share your optimism, but I don't think this bit helps your argument. Podcasts in particular do not scream "credibility"

> Podcasts in particular do not scream "credibility"

Except when they have on doctors who are experts on viral disease. For example: https://peterattiamd.com/category/podcast/

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#146

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

samsonradu wrote: post #140
SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like you've lost the thread here. Real Life™ is the part of the economy that's being shut down; over a billion people are no longer allowed to go to a cafe or speak to friends or continue their day to day activities. The concern isn't that an extended shutdown will be bad for Goldman Sachs, but that it will make ongoing life intolerable and resuming normal life impossible.

I think everyone agrees (govs included) that this situation is temporary. As soon as the balance inclines the other way as in less damaging overall to actually let the virus spread than current lockdown, the restrictions would be lifted. Why would people not resume life? We need to get the timing right, how much we can bend the curve without causing more harm. A matter of choosing the lesser evil.

I broadly agree with what you're saying, but I also agree with the original comment that the right timing is necessarily within the next six weeks. So when Cuomo goes up and says "two, three, four months", or when governments impose indefinite stay-at-home orders that need to be specifically revoked, that worries me.

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#147

Post by HeadsUpHigh »

cossray wrote: post #129
funcDropShadow wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are focused on the U.S., then I understand your sentiment. But if you look beyond, it is really promising. Medical science and biology are producing new scientific knowledge about CoViD-19 and SARS-Cov2 at break neck speed. That alone is amazing to see. On the other hand, you really see that people get it and that they have to do social distancing to help them and everybody else. On top of that you see, e.g. C…

As someone outside of the US, news about people of the City of Corona queuing to buy guns was quite shocking. Things are difficult everywhere but a rush to buy guns, not least in the most powerful country, is probably one of the most shocking of all the responses I have read and seen so far. I hope none of those guns will need to be used. The virus is already enough of an enemy

Eh calm down people always buy guns and ammo on every crisis that happens, even after every elections. It's nothing new.

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#148

Post by JoeAltmaier »

cossray wrote: post #129
funcDropShadow wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are focused on the U.S., then I understand your sentiment. But if you look beyond, it is really promising. Medical science and biology are producing new scientific knowledge about CoViD-19 and SARS-Cov2 at break neck speed. That alone is amazing to see. On the other hand, you really see that people get it and that they have to do social distancing to help them and everybody else. On top of that you see, e.g. C…

As someone outside of the US, news about people of the City of Corona queuing to buy guns was quite shocking. Things are difficult everywhere but a rush to buy guns, not least in the most powerful country, is probably one of the most shocking of all the responses I have read and seen so far. I hope none of those guns will need to be used. The virus is already enough of an enemy

Strangely there can be a calming effect, with many people armed. Believe it or not, unscrupulous folk may hesitate to act in times of shortage if their neighbors are armed.

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#149

Post by [deleted] »

znpy wrote: post #139
nikofeyn wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This crisis is the first event in my lifetime that's given me any optimism about our ability, as a global civilization, to solve problems and get things done. would you mind elaborating? because i find it extremely difficult how one could hold such an optimistic and apparent naive opinion. from where i sit, this crisis is showing the exact opposite. there is very little international communication and cooperation,…

> there is very little international communication and cooperation Indeed. The EU didn't really mind about Italy's problems and potential economic unease until it started affecting other european countries too. If you assume the european union being based, fundamentally, on cooperation then that really make you question the whole thing.

[deleted]

Re: Covid-19’s stop-gap solution until vaccines and antivirals are ready

#150

Post by LMYahooTFY »

DrAwdeOccarim wrote: post #75
_bxg1 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess I primarily mean the people on the ground. Not the politicians - the best that can be said about them is that they're getting out of the way (in some, not all cases) - but the doctors and nurses, the scientists, the grocery store workers, the companies converting their factories to make medical supplies, and yes, even the bureaucrats who are pushing this stuff through. There are still lots of people out there…

Not to bail Trump out because I have found his reactive leadership bad (all he had to do was get out of the way of the experts), but America--in my humble opinion--has always been bottom up. The idea that >300 million people can agree on anything always amazes me, and the design of the country is to allow as much autonomy to localities as possible while maintaining broad collaboration and cohesion. This is already sh…

>This is already shining where the US testing capacity has gone from basically zero to the highest in the world (>40k per day) in a matter of 2 weeks.

Do you have any sources/links for this? I've struggled to find credible info.

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