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Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

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Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#211

Post by JangoSteve »

Seenso wrote: post #156
fbelzile wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instead of regulation, maybe have browsers give you a warning on how the site your about to visit treats your personal data? We already have warnings in one way or another for: expired SSL certificates, lack of HTTPS, potential malware sites, if your account may have been breached (at least in Firefox), requests for your location or to show notifications, etc. The next logical step is to have our user agent warn us a…

>> There should be only one regulation for fb, display following warning on all pages/screens: Statutory Warning: This product is specifically designed to cause behavioral addiction so you are guided down a slippery slope of over consumption & that is how this company makes money. Overuse of this product is known to cause - anxiety, depression, low self esteem, constant craving for attention, short attention spans, i…

They've already done that. They're called the Facebook and Messenger native apps for Android and iOS. Conveniently, the Facebook mobile web app shows you Messenger notifications but won't let you read them without installing the native Messenger app, or visiting the Facebook on a desktop browser, despite the fact that direct messages have a much simpler interface than the rest of Facebook and that it used to be possible to view messages in the mobile web app, so they push for native app usage pretty hard already.

I'm not sure they'd see desktop browser warnings as much of an existential threat considering 94% of their advertising revenue comes from mobile [1].

[1] https://s21.q4cdn.com/399680738/files/doc_financials/2019/Q2...

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#212

Post by Nasrudith »

harikb wrote: post #93
KorematsuFred wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. FB has enriched my life at many ways, when my father was on deathbed I realized how much he used fb to just keep track of me every single time he remembered me. We spoke daily but I did not know he used facebook to "be with me". I do understand your criticism but it is in the same line as how christian priests opposed education for peasants. They argued that if the ordinary massed could read it would mean…

> I am pretty sure similar criticism has be forced on TV, Cellphones, Comic books and what not. No, there is a shit load of difference. It is far more costly to spread misinformation through those other channels. Sure nation-states and tv/cable-companies with agenda will still exist, but ordinary citizen like me, with an agenda, won’t be able to anonymously spread conspiracy theories for $100 ~ $1000

So the problem is that it isn't restricted to special interests? That sounds like the same logical flaw as cash bail models. If they are going to be a flight risk or going to go out and murder someone them having money available doesn't change if they are going to be a bad actor or not.

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#213

Post by SSSDFRO »

blunderkid wrote: post #16

There should be only one regulation for fb, display following warning on all pages/screens: Statutory Warning: This product is specifically designed to cause behavioral addiction so you are guided down a slippery slope of over consumption & that is how this company makes money. Overuse of this product is known to cause - anxiety, depression, low self esteem, constant craving for attention, short attention spans, inab…

Any regulations at all will just add to their moat. Stop cronyism by voting down all regulation period.

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#214

Post by SuoDuanDao »

blunderkid wrote: post #16

There should be only one regulation for fb, display following warning on all pages/screens: Statutory Warning: This product is specifically designed to cause behavioral addiction so you are guided down a slippery slope of over consumption & that is how this company makes money. Overuse of this product is known to cause - anxiety, depression, low self esteem, constant craving for attention, short attention spans, inab…

That didn't really work all that well for cigarettes.

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#215

Post by gargron »

donatj wrote: post #100
gargron wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The next generation of social networks is already here. It's decentralized and open-source. Mastodon, Pleroma, PeerTube, loads more, all part of the same network, the fediverse.

The only people who use decentralized and open-source social media are the people who care that it is decentralized and open-source. They are niche at best, no ones grandparents are on Mastodon.

I never said end-users should care that it's decentralized and open source. I am mentioning it because we're on HN, a tech-oriented website. The selling point of the fediverse is the governance model and sustainability, and the way these qualities are missing from Twitter/Facebook/&co has been in the mainstream consciousness for a few years already. Also the grandparents comment is nonsense. How many people's grandparents are on Snapchat or TikTok? How many people's grandparents are on Instagram? It's a completely arbitrary demographic goal post.

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#216

Post by [deleted] »

dangerface wrote: post #157
fbelzile wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instead of regulation, maybe have browsers give you a warning on how the site your about to visit treats your personal data? We already have warnings in one way or another for: expired SSL certificates, lack of HTTPS, potential malware sites, if your account may have been breached (at least in Firefox), requests for your location or to show notifications, etc. The next logical step is to have our user agent warn us a…

I like this idea, every website should have a popup warning you that it uses cookies and data. Maybe a politician older than my dad could come up with a regulation to enforce this, give it a catchy name like Governments Drunk Popup Regulation. Education is a good idea but in reality every site with google analytics is invading your personal data and people don't really care.

[deleted]

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#217

Post by justapassenger »

justaguyhere wrote: post #167
dokein wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Facebook is "evil" by design, but the end result is the same. The framework is as follows: There were probably thousands of internet companies that competed to be the dominant sites in the 90s and 00s. By several orders of magnitude the predominant business model is ads for eyeballs, and the predominant network effect scales with number of users. Several factors influenced success but, on average, sites…

We are all addicted to something or the other. There are people who spend insane amount of time on HN (including me) - sure it is billion times better than FB, but it is still an addiction. This is one of those things where no amount of regulation or blaming FB (or instagram or twitter or HN or whatever) is going to help much. It might be more fruitful to think about why people spend so much time online outside of pr…

> There are people who spend insane amount of time on HN (including me) - sure it is billion times better than FB, but it is still an addiction.

Why is it billion times better? I spend a lot of time on Facebook talking to my family that lives on the other side of the world. Is spending time talking with other geeks more valuable?

One site is owned by a huge corporation and other is owned by a company that tries to get rich by creating more corporations.

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#218

Post by justapassenger »

sprafa wrote: post #199
blunderkid wrote: post #16

There should be only one regulation for fb, display following warning on all pages/screens: Statutory Warning: This product is specifically designed to cause behavioral addiction so you are guided down a slippery slope of over consumption & that is how this company makes money. Overuse of this product is known to cause - anxiety, depression, low self esteem, constant craving for attention, short attention spans, inab…

There is a very simple solution to Facebook - demand that they offer compatibility through an API so that other products can offer News Feed products that are seamlessly integrated with the FB Friends. Same as having a universal messaging protocol that's compatible with WhatsApp, and an Instagram API that also allows for compatibility with competitive photo feed products. Basically - open up the social graph and allo…

> There is a very simple solution to Facebook - demand that they offer compatibility through an API so that other products can offer News Feed products that are seamlessly integrated with the FB Friends.

Allowing tons of third parties to access all your data. That’s for sure going to solve all the problems (and Facebook had same idea few years ago, that brought you Cambridge Analytica scandal)

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#219

Post by justapassenger »

harikb wrote: post #93
KorematsuFred wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. FB has enriched my life at many ways, when my father was on deathbed I realized how much he used fb to just keep track of me every single time he remembered me. We spoke daily but I did not know he used facebook to "be with me". I do understand your criticism but it is in the same line as how christian priests opposed education for peasants. They argued that if the ordinary massed could read it would mean…

> I am pretty sure similar criticism has be forced on TV, Cellphones, Comic books and what not. No, there is a shit load of difference. It is far more costly to spread misinformation through those other channels. Sure nation-states and tv/cable-companies with agenda will still exist, but ordinary citizen like me, with an agenda, won’t be able to anonymously spread conspiracy theories for $100 ~ $1000

Sentiment on HN - you can spread any theory for $1000 and you’ll reach tons of people who engage and believe you.

Also sentiment on HN - ads don’t work and companies spend billions of dollars for nothing.

Re: Facebook asks for a moat of regulations it already meets

#220

Post by c22 »

JangoSteve wrote: post #211
Seenso wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> There should be only one regulation for fb, display following warning on all pages/screens: Statutory Warning: This product is specifically designed to cause behavioral addiction so you are guided down a slippery slope of over consumption & that is how this company makes money. Overuse of this product is known to cause - anxiety, depression, low self esteem, constant craving for attention, short attention spans, i…

They've already done that. They're called the Facebook and Messenger native apps for Android and iOS. Conveniently, the Facebook mobile web app shows you Messenger notifications but won't let you read them without installing the native Messenger app, or visiting the Facebook on a desktop browser, despite the fact that direct messages have a much simpler interface than the rest of Facebook and that it used to be possi…

I haven't used Facebook in a couple years but mbasic.facebook.com used to let you see your messages.
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