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Mozilla lays off 70

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Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#821

Post by wyoh »

intarga wrote: post #781
senderista wrote: post #621

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have definitely gotten the impression (as a very peripheral observer of the Rust community) that ideological diversity is not at all the sort of diversity Mozilla is interested in.

Given the context, I take ideological diversity to mean inclusion of people who are sexist, homophobic, and transphobic. The identity characteristic here revolves around the exclusion of others, how in any sense does that make it reasonable to include them in the name of diversity? You're asking people to tolerate intolerance in the name of tolerance. I can't see such a request as anything less than insincere.

You're part of the problem by thinking anyone with differing opinions is sexist racist transphobic and any other ism.

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#822

Post by foldr »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #820
foldr wrote: post #802

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Do they abide by work regulations and treat everyone equally/equitably (as the org requires)? Probably not. But in any case, why should non-white coworkers be expected to work with a racist just because the person in question (hypothetically) puts on a token display of being tolerant? It's insulting and demeaning to ask them to put up with that. You seem more interested in defending some implausibly courteous hypoth…

If a person is a white supremacist, black supremacist, Indian supremacist, whatever, perhaps through working side-by-side towards common goals they can learn not only to fake non-discrimination but to adopt it as an ideology. If they're functionally equivalent to everyone else in their work I can't see a _reason_ to exclude them other than bigotry. They're wrong, outside work I'm happy to address that head on; peace…

>If a person is a white supremacist, black supremacist, Indian supremacist, whatever, perhaps through working side-by-side towards common goals they can learn not only to fake non-discrimination but to adopt it as an ideology.

That's a nice thought, but it's unfair to put the burden of rehabilitation of white supremacists on your colleagues.

>If they're functionally equivalent to everyone else in their work I can't see a _reason_ to exclude them other than bigotry.

The idea of them being "functionally equivalent" is a philosophical hypothetical, not a realistic possibility. (Do you think someone who thinks black people are inferior to white people is going to make fair decisions about e.g. who gets promoted?) But apart from this, it's dehumanising and humiliating to make people work with others who regard them as inferior on the basis of their race.

>Presumably you find Muslims, whose religious book demands they murder those who won't convert, to be anathema in your workplace?

I find Muslims who want to murder non-Muslisms anathema in my workplace, yes. I work with a few Muslims, but curiously, none of them want to do this. But come on, your comment here is borderline trolling, and makes me question whether you're really being serious about white supremacists either.

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#823

Post by dgudkov »

Mozilla lays off people, yet it still doesn't accept donations. I don't understand it - there are tons of people (including me) would gladly donate to Mozilla to keep it afloat. Yet, you can only donate to the Mozilla foundation, but not to Mozilla Corporation (that develops the browser).

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#824

Post by wdanilo »

sstangl wrote: post #376

I'm one of the 70. There were no signs that this was imminent, although Mozilla has been struggling financially for many years. I expected that it would happen eventually; I'm relatively well-prepared for it; and it's not too shocking. I did however expect that there would be some warning signs in the lead-up, but that was not the case. I was working on Cranelift, the WebAssembly compiler that is also a plausible fut…

LUNA (http://luna-lang.org) - write to us! :)

I'm one of the founders. We are looking for senior compiler engineers (GraalVM) and senior WebGL developers (Rust ) in our team. We are doing a visual programming language for data science and we just got funding of $2.5M. We'd love to chat :)

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#825

Post by gr__or »

wyoh wrote: post #821
intarga wrote: post #781

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the context, I take ideological diversity to mean inclusion of people who are sexist, homophobic, and transphobic. The identity characteristic here revolves around the exclusion of others, how in any sense does that make it reasonable to include them in the name of diversity? You're asking people to tolerate intolerance in the name of tolerance. I can't see such a request as anything less than insincere.

You're part of the problem by thinking anyone with differing opinions is sexist racist transphobic and any other ism.

They did clearly state "given the context". The context being someone who, supposedly (I don't know, that was before my time and outside of my circles), had those traits.

So I think saying "by thinking anyone with differing opinions is Xist" is a mischaracterization of what was expressed originally.

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#826

Post by modo_mario »

pier25 wrote: post #321
squarefoot wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a great browser, once we agree on priorities on what they should be great at. All modern browsers suck badly wrt UI. User interfaces dumbed down to unusability is the new fashion and both Chrome and Mozilla suffer equally from that (which is why I use Waterfox Classic). But while FF focuses on privacy, and definitely delivers in this context, Chrome and others don't, by design. I would happily trade 50% of ever…

It's not one or the other. FF could have the best UI and the best privacy features.

Do you know how customisable firefox's UI is in ways that chrome isn't? They limited it a bit in recent years so you can no longer can easily turn the url bar and tab bar into one bar which i'm sad about but all in all most of the buttons i don't use i can remove, those i do i can add, i can change the colours, shapes and location. Chrome is ugly by default and doesn't allow me to fix it.

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#827

Post by m3adow »

BrendanEich wrote: post #733
m3adow wrote: post #713

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Still 100% depending on Google, still supporting a near monopolistic position for the browser. Every Chromium fork is part of the problem, not the solution.

Engine consolidation happened, the fight now is over privacy. When and if Brave is big enough we will chart our own engine course.

To stay in the martialistic metaphor: In this fight you merely wield the weapons your opponent forges for you. If Google decides to dull your edge in the fight for privacy, you have little influence to sharpen it again.

The only reason you are even able to fight this battle is because of the existance of Firefox. All of the Chrome based browsers are toothless tigers without Mozilla.

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#828

Post by modo_mario »

flukus wrote: post #397
pier25 wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm I don't know. I switched to FF 4 months ago and while the engine and dev tools are great, it's simply not as polished as the competition. For example just look at the alert popups[0], or the non native contextual menus, or the video pop icon. The UI is full of little quirks like that. The tab bar is by far the ugliest one of all current browsers, at least on macOS. It also misses important features such as multil…

> The tab bar is by far the ugliest one of all current browsers, at least on macOS. It's horrible on all platforms ;) . The way tabs are handled is by far my biggest complaint, you can't fit as many tabs in as with chrome and since they "upgraded" the extension system the vertical tab extensions don't work well (can't remove top tab panel). I wish they'd just make a native UI for each platform, their cross platform o…

Wait you can't scroll trough tabs on macOS? I have hundreds open and can read em perfectly fine

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#829

Post by modo_mario »

shpeedy wrote: post #309
throwaway123x2 wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's crazy how much FF's marketshare has dropped. It's such a great browser.

Firefox eats memory. 4GB of memory is barely enough to run browser and show few tabs.

Chrome eats way more across the board in my experience

Re: Mozilla lays off 70

#830

Post by gr__or »

dgudkov wrote: post #823

Mozilla lays off people, yet it still doesn't accept donations. I don't understand it - there are tons of people (including me) would gladly donate to Mozilla to keep it afloat. Yet, you can only donate to the Mozilla foundation, but not to Mozilla Corporation (that develops the browser).

Afaik companies can't ask for donations in the US.
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