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Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

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Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#431

Post by CydeWeys »

true_religion wrote: post #370
CydeWeys wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you realize how catastrophically expensive it would be to build and maintain all of these bridges and pathways along with the four elevators per intersection? And how closed in and claustrophobic it would make the street level feel like from blocking out so much sun? If this idea were viable, someone somewhere in the world would have already done it. But the closest I can think of is Las Vegas, and that's only alo…

Downtown Manila basically has bridges over every intersection, or underground walkways with elevators for the disabled. It works out great. Though admittedly it’s more of a workout than walking in flat Manhattan.

So you've got to go up and down to cross every single intersection? That sounds like a nightmare that makes walking take significantly longer.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#432

Post by phreeza »

gokhan wrote: post #13

One interesting observation on Oslo is that, pedestrians do cross the street when it's red for them, if there's no moving traffic close by. This is totally different from, for example, Copenhagen, Stockholm and places I visited in Germany. They're like Italians of the north. That's probably why we felt at home on the streets during our stay there, as a family from Turkey. I would love to have that 0 deaths statistics…

In Germany, people generally do ignore red lights when there are no cars around. The big exception is when kids are present. Crossing a red light when a kid is watching you can get you reprimand by strangers, or will earn you dirty looks at the least.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#433

Post by oska »

Shalle135 wrote: post #331
gokhan wrote: post #13

One interesting observation on Oslo is that, pedestrians do cross the street when it's red for them, if there's no moving traffic close by. This is totally different from, for example, Copenhagen, Stockholm and places I visited in Germany. They're like Italians of the north. That's probably why we felt at home on the streets during our stay there, as a family from Turkey. I would love to have that 0 deaths statistics…

In Stockholm it’s really common to jaywalk. There is a law against it, but there is no punishment unless you caused a dangerous situation so you’re not going to get stopped by the cops for doing so. Also I was quite suprised the first time I heard of it being on to run a red light if you’re turning right. This is not legal AFAIK in all of Scandinavia nor the majority of Europe.

I'd suggest not even using the word 'jaywalk'. It's a propaganda word.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#434

Post by perbu »

rconti wrote: post #390
turk73 wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Need to look at total miles driven, not just population size vs. number of deaths. Doesn't Norway have huge taxes on automobiles which chill ownership? If so, then population is not relevant. If only 10% of people can afford to own cars, then the number of crashes and fatalities will certainly be low. The US standard of living is far higher. Whether that leads to more fatalities or not is anybody's guess. I would pre…

Speed limits are incredibly low. I drove across Norway this summer and never saw a speed limit higher than 50mph.

Highway speeds are 90-110km/h (55-70mph). General speed limits are 80km/h and 50km/h (50/30mph) depending on pop. density.

Speeds are often reduced if the road is sub par or if there have been accidents on that bit of road.

Yes. The limits are low, but definitivly not _incredibly_ low.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#435

Post by bluGill »

CydeWeys wrote: post #428
bluGill wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many cities in fact already have it. We call them skyways. The bridge is building to building. It is generally not on the corners, but in the middle of the block. Getting in is tricky because you need to find the elevator in the middle of the building, but once in you don't leave for a while so that isn't a big deal.

Yeah, I'm aware of what skyways are. And there's no city in which they remotely come close to covering as much walking territory as sidewalks do.

True, but they do cover most of the areas where a large number of people want to be often.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#436

Post by bluGill »

mumblemumble wrote: post #405
bluGill wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if it is 4 miles to the grocery store, then you can't walk anywhere. Your ice cream will melt before you get back home. There might be a continuous sidewalk all the way, but you have better things to do with your time than walk that far.

You can walk to a neighbor's house. Surely that counts as somewhere? Seriously, get out and meet your neighbors.

That is all. It doesn't count. Can you walk to work, church, the grocery store, other dry goods stores, restaurants, or even your friend from years ago who moved? In cities you can do all of the above in some form (meaning you might not like the store, but at least there is one)

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#437

Post by tristor »

These types of stats are almost meaningless to compare because most of the difference in outcomes is caused by cultural differences which are difficult and unlikely to change. There are two factors that have more effect on traffic safety in the US than anything else when compared to most of the rest of the world: 1) More total miles driven per capita, 2) Distracted driving.

To expand on #2 above, most of the world still predominantly drives manual transmission vehicles, and licensing and enforcing standards are much higher, as well as cultural factors which increase driving engagement. All of this culminates in the average driver being much much more attentive of their surroundings outside the US than inside the US. In the US its nearly the reverse, majority of vehicles are automatic transmissions, almost all newer cars now have BLISS and other automated safety systems which are a reaction to fatalities from distracted driving. Texting while driving is epidemic and is more dangerous now in most states than drunk driving is.

Replicating the factors that Oslo has which drives their stats in the US is likely to be impossible, and probably would create such far-reaching consequences that it's also undesirable.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#438

Post by alkonaut »

turk73 wrote: post #365
Mvhsz wrote: post #354

Some contextual data from US cities in 2018 City – City Population (Metro Area Population), City Density per Square Mile, City Traffic Fatalities Oslo [1]: 690,335 (1,588,457), 3,938, 1 Nashville [2][3]: 692,587 (1,930,961), 1,374, 82 Portland [4][5]: 653,115 (2,478,810), 4,911, 34 Milwaukee [6][7]: 592,025 (1,572,245), 6,155, 68 [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nashville,_Tenn…

Need to look at total miles driven, not just population size vs. number of deaths. Doesn't Norway have huge taxes on automobiles which chill ownership? If so, then population is not relevant. If only 10% of people can afford to own cars, then the number of crashes and fatalities will certainly be low. The US standard of living is far higher. Whether that leads to more fatalities or not is anybody's guess. I would pre…

> US standard of living is far higher.

Than Norway? The country with 25% higher GDP per capita than the US, a 33h average work week, and an infant mortality rate of a first world country? Nah

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#439

Post by elweston2 »

isoskeles wrote: post #322
elweston2 wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It varies from state to state and city to city. Some have the very regulation you are talking about. I have never seen it enforced. In your case if there was no indicator light. Then you could go for it when the traffic was going in the same direction as you or when clear from the other direction. The general rule of thumb is from any corner you can cross. That does not mean you get to stop traffic to do so. Though i…

> They seem surprised when I honk at them. Maybe roll down your window and say something instead of blaring your horn at people who aren’t encased in a car. Although I am not sure why you think you have a right to teach strangers a lesson.

When the dude is walking across a 3 way 45MPH in each direction street in a low light situation. Then 1 block away was a well lit cross walk. Yeah he gets the horn. Sorry if I did not make that clear. Did not think I had to... Oh that happened to me just last week. Although I am not sure why you think it is OK for that 1 dude to hold up about 40 other people.

Re: Oslo had 0 pedestrian, 0 cyclist, 0 children and 1 driver trafic deaths in 2019

#440

Post by bjelkeman-again »

bluGill wrote: post #255
blattimwind wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost like it would make sense to have at least legally separate pathways for motorized, less motorized (scooters, e-bikes), bicycles and pedestrians, because they are very different forms of transport.

It makes perfect sense in theory. In the real world though space is limited. We cannot have separate spaces: there isn't enough room - unless you space things out so far that only only car transport makes sense, at which point why bother building paths for the other modes? Which is why suburbs don't have sidewalks: there is no place you can practically go by any mode other than car so why bother creating space for th…

There is no space? I am surprised. Sweden has separate bike lanes and walking paths in the suburbs. A lot of Northern Europe is the same.
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