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EU beckons Indian tech talent

economictimes.indiatimes.com

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Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#111

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

d44m wrote: post #108

I look at it as a simple trade of goods. Hiring a Software Engineer from India is like an Indian buying a German car. If Germany can export cars to India and France can export wines, then India can export their talent. So, if you are confident of your skills and what they are worth, you should naturally go to the USA.

>I look at it as a simple trade of goods. Hiring a Software Engineer from India is like an Indian buying a German car.

That's by far the silliest thing I've read this week. Even beats Trump's tweets.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#112

Post by d44m »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #111
d44m wrote: post #108

I look at it as a simple trade of goods. Hiring a Software Engineer from India is like an Indian buying a German car. If Germany can export cars to India and France can export wines, then India can export their talent. So, if you are confident of your skills and what they are worth, you should naturally go to the USA.

>I look at it as a simple trade of goods. Hiring a Software Engineer from India is like an Indian buying a German car. That's by far the silliest thing I've read this week. Even beats Trump's tweets.

It's not conventional thinking, but this is how trade works.

Most trade treaties now consider the human element too (like in the case of EU, which allows free people movement for employment, just like free goods movement).

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#113

Post by thbr99 »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #16

I wish EU work visa restrictions would be as high as the US ones. Tech salaries in Western Europe are low enough as it is and the whole developer shortage the employers keep crying about to the media is a scam to justify lax visa restrictions for cheaper workforce from abroad. Under current conditions EU companies can hire pretty much anyone across the globe. Do you think SV salaries would be as high as they are if t…

If Indians and Chineese can live there with the salary they get. Why can't you ? What makes you different ?

Indians & Chineese are buying foreign products in their countries. Why can't other countries accept goods(human resources) in return ? It's a global economy.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#114

Post by d44m »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #66
zerr wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU is just a yet another set of deals. Switzerland is not even a EU member - it has a yet another set of deals. There are reasons for such deals as with Blue card deals or similar. Preferring one deal over another just because of nationality or race is wrong.

Hiring restrictions to the EU exclusively have nothing to do with race but they do with nationality and there's nothing wrong with that. As an EU national and EU taxpayer for decades, I expect to be a first class citizen of my region and the governing bodies to prioritize my well being first as much as I expect the US or Chinese or Indian governments to prioritize the well being of thier citizens first as opposed to…

Any foreigner working in the EU also has to pay taxes, just like a citizen.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#115

Post by foepys »

thbr99 wrote: post #113
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #16

I wish EU work visa restrictions would be as high as the US ones. Tech salaries in Western Europe are low enough as it is and the whole developer shortage the employers keep crying about to the media is a scam to justify lax visa restrictions for cheaper workforce from abroad. Under current conditions EU companies can hire pretty much anyone across the globe. Do you think SV salaries would be as high as they are if t…

If Indians and Chineese can live there with the salary they get. Why can't you ? What makes you different ? Indians & Chineese are buying foreign products in their countries. Why can't other countries accept goods(human resources) in return ? It's a global economy.

Indian and Chinese immigrants don't have family in the EU. They might have one later but they don't need a higher salary to support them when they first move to the EU.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#116

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

blue_box wrote: post #101
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #16

I wish EU work visa restrictions would be as high as the US ones. Tech salaries in Western Europe are low enough as it is and the whole developer shortage the employers keep crying about to the media is a scam to justify lax visa restrictions for cheaper workforce from abroad. Under current conditions EU companies can hire pretty much anyone across the globe. Do you think SV salaries would be as high as they are if t…

> We have enough skilled workers in the EU. No you don't. Companies have to prove that they couldn't find a person who fits the position before hiring. Otherwise they have to hire someone in EU.

Tho whole we couldn't find anyone in the EU for this job spiel that companies play is just a immigration scam approved with a rubber stamp by the authorities.

Let me fill you in on how it works:

Company puts up job ad with a salary so low no one in their right mind would even consider applying for. After 30 days of no applications(what a surprise) company goes to the local authorities and tells them that no one in the EU applied and that it's already hurting their business an suddenly, BAM!, working visa secured for the next gullible fool who doesn't know the market.

This abuse is so easy, every company does it and the government is ok with it as it keeps the companies happy.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#117

Post by chpmrc »

inertiatic wrote: post #88
chpmrc wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you think SV salaries would be as high as they are if they could import any workers hassle free? Yes, given there are many companies paying SV salaries to remote devs from all over the planet. (Off the top of my head: Buffer, HotJar, Superside, Stack Overflow)

I thought HotJar positions advertised 70-90k, a number that would also be adjusted further based on cost of living.

That's in EUR, 90k EUR is ~100k USD.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#118

Post by d44m »

thrower123 wrote: post #84
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole fear of outsourcing is a myth companies use to deregulate immigration and it needs to stop being used as fear mongering to justify lax regulations. If outsourcing was so good why hasn't all of SV packed and moved abroad already to cheap countries or even to cheaper states in the US instead of offering insane salaries at home? Companies stay in the west because of the ecosystem comprised of stable government…

Because outsourcing fails and is abandoned after two or three years, when the real costs have become apparent. The bastards that thought it up have moved up and out on the strengths of the initial cost savings by the time those chickens come home to roost. You don't have to see this kind of cycle too many times before you get a little cynical.

I've been in the IT industry for close to 20 years now. Outsourcing as a factor is not significant in project failures.

Also, most outsourcing companies have been around for a while and are doing fairly well.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#119

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

d44m wrote: post #112
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I look at it as a simple trade of goods. Hiring a Software Engineer from India is like an Indian buying a German car. That's by far the silliest thing I've read this week. Even beats Trump's tweets.

It's not conventional thinking, but this is how trade works. Most trade treaties now consider the human element too (like in the case of EU, which allows free people movement for employment, just like free goods movement).

>It's not conventional thinking, but this is how trade works.

Trading cars for migrant workers is exactly how trade doesn't work.

You're talking nonsense here. EU has a trade and migration deal between the EU member states, not with India.

Re: EU beckons Indian tech talent

#120

Post by foepys »

tluyben2 wrote: post #97
Vesuvium wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech companies cluster in big cities, which are expensive. 50k in a small town is lots, 50k in London or Amsterdam is pocket money.

Yeah, so the EU should focus more on stimulating remote work instead of stuffing cities like the rest of the world.

While I agree that this needs to be the future, nearly all current development shows that this isn't the case - worldwide. I couldn't name a country with a strong software industry where it isn't concentrated in one or two large cities.
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