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When will Google shut down Stadia?

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Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#351

Post by pavel_lishin »

uncletaco wrote: post #101
itg wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I hear, this is due to the promo driven culture at Google. You can good reviews/promos based on new products that get pushed to market, nobody cares about maintenance at Google.

I heard that Facebook and Google collect engineers and let them do whatever because its better than them being productive at a competitor.

Doesn't seem like they do "whatever", but rather "whatever they're told" - otherwise they'd be free to maintain passion projects (like our beloved Reader.)

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#352

Post by thebokehwokeh2 »

pm90 wrote: post #145
uncletaco wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard that Facebook and Google collect engineers and let them do whatever because its better than them being productive at a competitor.

Textbook anti competitive behavior. Google needs to be broken up.

When people say this, what exactly does this mean? If you break Google up into Gmail, Search, Calendar, etc... what stops those from within, who have intimate knowledge of the innerworkings and HR related matters within Alphabet as a whole, from simply secretly colluding and sharing resources off the books?

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#353

Post by monocasa »

sjs382 wrote: post #292
monocasa wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does one provide migration paths when Google owns the data, licenses, etc. on their servers? Just one of many ways that Service as a Software Substitute reduces user freedom.

Google will provide you with downloads your data for a lot of their projects: https://takeout.google.com/

But for stadia, where the game licenses, executables, and probably save games probably can't be exported legally, how does one provide a migration paths once Google inevitably says "servers are shutting down in three months. You will lose access to everything on that date. We will give you a month free or something that in no way makes up for the service shutting down and you losing everything"

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#354

Post by Izkata »

dividuum wrote: post #68
windsurfer wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Modern multiplayer games already do the "world model" calculations on the server, with clients simply rendering the little data they have.

That only partly helps with cheating. Client side cheat software still has access to the internal game state and can modify rendering (so you see in the dark for example) or input (point the gun at any visible opponent). If you only remotely control a video stream, that's harder. I guess the next step would then be computer vision on the video stream.

> I guess the next step would then be computer vision on the video stream.

Matching output seen on the screen has existed for decades under the umbrella of macros. I remember writing my own for an MMO around 2005 using AutoIt; it was significantly easier than any client modification.

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#355

Post by afishisafish »

steelframe wrote: post #138
juped wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has a Google product ever been good? - Search (was once good, now just "marginally better than Bing") - Reader (was good, the highest profile victim of Google Death Syndrome)

> Has a Google product ever been good? Uhhh... Maps? Mail? Pixel 2 and 3? Fi? Sheets? Sure, their Cloud doesn't sell as much as Amazon's, but it's been praised as being a much more coherent product. Not sure how anyone could argue that Google hasn't gotten it right several times.

G-suite (Docs, Drive, ...)

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#356

Post by [deleted] »

heywoods wrote: post #303
mbell wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Stadia is different, with this product Google is trying something really innovative. Genuine question: What is innovative here? There are at least a dozen attempts at 'cloud gaming' that I'm aware of dating back about a decade.

I think I can help answer your question, but just watching the keynote will be best. https://youtu.be/hl-Y1QVhmcM . The tl;dr of the whole keynote is what's different about Google's attempt at 'Cloud Gaming' is their ability to leverage their infrastructure. Outside of Amazon and Microsoft I don't know of another company that will be able to match the latency and computation requirements to make this all work as mark…

[deleted]

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#357

Post by chipotle_coyote »

inetknght wrote: post #166
shadowgovt wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW though, setting up a mail server is difficult. Setting up a mail client with reasonable spam filtering to make email usable is also difficult. Compare the list of steps on either of those tasks to the list for getting email via Gmail: "1) Sign up to a Google account, 2) visit gmail.com"; it's obvious almost all users are going to do the latter (or its equivalent at a Google competitor).

Setting up a mail server isn't difficult. It's about as easy as installing and configuring a web server, and just about as technical. Email has been around for decades. The fact that Gmail, Yahoo, Hotmail, and many paid services have had one-click email addresses for twenty-plus years should demonstrate that it's not difficult . Businesses just don't want to make it easy for lay people to do it.

Unless email servers have gotten a lot more turnkey in the last few years, I'm gonna disagree with this, sorry. :) I can get nginx running on most systems with literally a couple commands ("package-manager-thing install nginx" and "service-manager-thing start nginx"). Getting a mail server running -- at least in any form that qualifies as "Gmail replacement" -- seems to involve "install postfix, immediately edit the configuration because it has no out-of-the-box defaults, create multiple configuration files beyond that because that's how postfix rolls, install dovecot, immediately edit its configuration because it has no out-of-the-box defaults either, create some directories and user accounts and more configuration files because that's how dovecot rolls, then test that everything's working." And I'm leaving out the "install MySQL" part that many guides you'll find online will also have you do. Also, I haven't talked about running a spam filter and YOUR HARD DRIVE IS ALREADY FULL OF NIGERIAN PRINCES TRYING TO SELL YOU PENIS-ENLARGING BITCOIN I'M SO SORRY.

I would love it if "package-manager-thing install mail-server-thing" and "service-manager-thing start mail-server-thing" could get things going with sensible defaults like they do with nginx, even if you'd probably need to tweak things after they were going just like you're almost certainly going to do with a web server. But AFAIK, that just ain't the case.

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#358

Post by monocasa »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #345
monocasa wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does one provide migration paths when Google owns the data, licenses, etc. on their servers? Just one of many ways that Service as a Software Substitute reduces user freedom.

For our favorite example, Google Reader, you could export your list of feeds, and import them into (e.g.) Newsblur.

But that can't apply to stadia.

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#359

Post by hyperdimension »

40acres wrote: post #238
mempko wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize that streaming games is an old idea and has been tried many times and Google's competitors do or will have similar services. Google isn't doing anything new here. They don't have any first-move advantage. The only advantage they have is infrastructure and scale. Whether that is enough, we shall see.

I do understand that this is an old idea. My TV actually has a steaming service for games built in but I have never used it because I doubt the performance would be up to standard. The innovation is not necessarily in the product but in the engineering required to make the product feasible. There is a long history of tech that simply is too early for the current environment. Google is betting the cloud gaming has rea…

> My TV actually has a steaming service

Nice Freudian slip there. We have a "smart" TV here that's never been connected to the Internet. They seem to just universally suck.

For extra credit, our TV is a Roku TV, and from the CEOs comments, I doubt I'll ever connect it to the Internet. At least until they start coming with 4G connectivity built-in...(!)

Re: When will Google shut down Stadia?

#360

Post by nilkn »

SmirkingRevenge wrote: post #350
mmanfrin wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glass cost money, more than 10x what this cost, and that was not a signal of their long term ambition. The problem with Stadia is that it costs money, the service costs a monthly fee, and on top of it you have to buy the games. What happens to those games if you stop paying the fee? If you stop using Stadia? If Google deprecates Stadia like many are worried. I'll tell you: you lose the game. If I, conversely, buy the…

PC's don't generally need a subscription service to access games or multiplayer, but your upfront hardware costs to play modern AAA games are huge. And existing consoles require you to: * pay a large upfront fee for the hardware * purchase games at full price * buy a recurring subscription service for access to updates and essentials, like multiplayer. Stadia doesn't seem unreasonable at all by comparison.

The biggest problem I see with this right now is that Stadia appears to be sub-console quality and really nowhere close to PC gaming. The Pro service that is supposed to be 4K@60 is not at all 4K.

I do agree that if it reaches the point where Stadia allows you to effectively rent a $3k - $4k high end gaming PC for just $10/month, it will become an interesting proposition.

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