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Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

improveyoursocialskills.com

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Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#81

Post by emerongi »

kempbellt wrote: post #61
wisty wrote: post #43

Why are social skills always focusing on the positive? A lot of programmers often seem to be more nice guys than anything else, and need to be able to be more assertive / aggressive. Everyone tries to distinguish these two, it's mostly just in the eye of the beholder - IMO aggression is just assertion when it's judged to be inappropriate or incompetently done - a drill instructor being assertive looks different to a…

I agree with this. I value high-friction environments where people are encouraged to compete and fight to support their ideas, where they feel valued for fighting for themselves, rather than patronized... The real world doesn't coddle you. Work should reflect that to some degree - with some respect to being a decent person in general. Just knowing that you know your shit, and it's okay (preferred even), if you fight…

The real world doesn't coddle you, but your close acquaintances definitely do.

A week ago I saw an animal documentary where a lion was attacked by a pack of hyenas. A while later, another lion saw the situation and ran to help; the hyenas knew they couldn't take two lions so they fled. Afterwards, the lions cuddled. Both lions benefited: the first one might help the second one out in the future.

I would argue that one of the reasons why humans have taken over the world is that we help eachother and work together. If Bob has a bad knee and can't hunt, it doesn't mean Bob is useless and we should kill him. Bob can stay home and build weapons for the hunters.

Of course, if Bob is taking advantage of the situation and does fuck-all, positive reinforcement won't do anything. However, it does not mean the environment has to continually be abrasive and competitive, especially not for the rest of the group who are doing their job.

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#82

Post by wisty »

solatic wrote: post #72
wisty wrote: post #43

Why are social skills always focusing on the positive? A lot of programmers often seem to be more nice guys than anything else, and need to be able to be more assertive / aggressive. Everyone tries to distinguish these two, it's mostly just in the eye of the beholder - IMO aggression is just assertion when it's judged to be inappropriate or incompetently done - a drill instructor being assertive looks different to a…

> IMO aggression is just assertion when it's judged to be inappropriate or incompetently done One can be assertive without being aggressive and aggressive without being assertive. They are different characteristics. Assertive and not aggressive - deciding to speak up instead of being silent. "Excuse me, can you explain this decision to me?" Aggressive and not assertive - being passive-aggressive, giving people the si…

So is a polite legal threat assertive or aggressive?

edit: I'm saying - where you draw the line is about things like whether it's competent, and whether it's "OK" within the contex. A polite "excuse me" is both competent and almost always "OK". A polite legal threat might not be "OK" (and it might not be competent either) so whether you judge it to be aggressive will depend on your point of view.

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#83

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

x2f10 wrote: post #74
wallflower wrote: post #53

While some of you may make light of the fact that I am giving you advice, my single most important piece of advice to people who are highly analytical and/or always solving problems is to not give unsolicited advice to friends, family, acquaintances, or even strangers. People will ask for advice if they really want it. People are not “broken pieces of code” begging to be fixed. I’ve lost friends over this, until one…

You are spot on. I have had to learn this multiple times. If the person is not willing to accept the observation with open arms (hint: most are not), you will only push the person away. However, I can't help but see the small irony in your reply. >[do not] give unsolicited advice to friends, family, acquaintances, or even strangers >one dear friend [gave me unsolicited advice which helped]

I think the standard psycho-therapeutic "tell them how it makes you feel" advice applies here and accounts for the difference. It's one thing to give unsolicited advice to someone. It's quite another to tell a close friend "Look, I need to tell you something important because I care about you. When you start telling me all the ways I should change to be a 'better person', it really makes me feel bad, and makes me not want to hang around you. It certainly doesn't motivate me to actually make any of your suggested changes."

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#84

Post by Wesxdz »

NegatioN wrote: post #28

I feel like Jonathan Blow's most recent talk[0] touches on why communication is important from a selfish perspective, for us as "artisans"/creatives. It's doesn't have to be about pleasing someone higher up in the hierarchy, it's about communicating in such a way that the diff between what's in your mind, and the other person's mind is as small as possible. In doing this, we can more often achieve what we want, and h…

Username checks out. Thanks for the link, I love Jonathan Blow's talks :)

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#85

Post by therealcamino »

x2f10 wrote: post #79
throwaway07Ju19 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've taken this even further. I no longer correct any factual mistakes or misspoken words unless the person making this error is either a student or someone who reads. Even then it may be best to not say anything.

> or someone who reads. Can you please elaborate? I don't follow.

Often, mispronouncing a word means you've seen it in print, but haven't heard it said aloud. So I've heard some people say that they mentally frame it not as an embarrassing mistake but as a sign that the speaker reads a lot.

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#86

Post by liveoneggs »

rmbryan wrote: post #19
christiansakai wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a wife, I code, exercise, play weekend music gig, do aquascaping, and read various theological books and random books in random topics. . . . . . . Too bad I suck at all those above, and still suck in my social skills.

aquascaping sounds interesting. is there an online community you recommend?

https://www.reddit.com/r/PlantedTank/

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#87

Post by kempbellt »

notJim wrote: post #77
kempbellt wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this. I value high-friction environments where people are encouraged to compete and fight to support their ideas, where they feel valued for fighting for themselves, rather than patronized... The real world doesn't coddle you. Work should reflect that to some degree - with some respect to being a decent person in general. Just knowing that you know your shit, and it's okay (preferred even), if you fight…

In my experience, the problem with environments like that is that the best fighters win, not the best ideas. The best fighters are usually the people who can project the most confidence, talk the loudest, and who are the most popular. By contrast, environments that provide psychological safety enable people who may have better ideas, but may not be as brash and overconfident to contribute.

I understand your perspective. Unfortunately, however idealistic, I don't see that being a great benefit in the long term for anyone.

I prefer environments that teach you how to advocate for your ideas. Build you up as a good self-advocate.

Environments that say "Hey everybody! It's Timmy's turn to speak. Pass him the talking stick" are patronizing and disgust me at the onset.

Better to have someone by your side saying, "Timmy, speak up! You have a great idea. Tell everyone"

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#88

Post by Dumblydorr »

SolaceQuantum wrote: post #60
Sharlin wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To add to this, it’s important is to realize that even when people open up to you about their problems, that still does not mean that they are asking for advice! It’s very likely that what they primarily want and need from you is sympathy and validation. If you’re unsure, ask first.

Often it's useful to mentally frame this as that the problem is that the speaker feels unheard, not that they're speaking about a problem.

And that more often than not, the speaker already knows potential solutions and next steps, they just want you to agree that it sucks. Too often, solutions driven people try to solve venters' problems rather than simply listening to what they are.

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#89

Post by [deleted] »

wallflower wrote: post #53

While some of you may make light of the fact that I am giving you advice, my single most important piece of advice to people who are highly analytical and/or always solving problems is to not give unsolicited advice to friends, family, acquaintances, or even strangers. People will ask for advice if they really want it. People are not “broken pieces of code” begging to be fixed. I’ve lost friends over this, until one…

[deleted]

Re: Basic Social Skills Guide (2012)

#90

Post by rollerboi »

wallflower wrote: post #53

While some of you may make light of the fact that I am giving you advice, my single most important piece of advice to people who are highly analytical and/or always solving problems is to not give unsolicited advice to friends, family, acquaintances, or even strangers. People will ask for advice if they really want it. People are not “broken pieces of code” begging to be fixed. I’ve lost friends over this, until one…

I've been working on this since I noticed it in myself a few years back. It's really difficult because I'm the "problem-solver," but I'm also the person that people want to vent to.

So I've come to realize - After a friend/coworker shares something that they're sad/angry about, my standard MO is:

1) Say something like "Wow, that must really feel terrible. I'm sorry to hear that!" (I always feel the need to add more to this statement, but it's better off said with a light touch and not heavy-handed.) Then,

2) "I feel like I was in a similar situation a few months ago when..." Important rule about this step - this statement is NOT to be a 1-upper. You're not saying this to proclaim that your situation from the past is more significant/worse than their situation. You're saying this because it helps your friend/colleague understand that they're not alone in how they're feeling, and their feelings are (generally-speaking) justified. Also - You don't talk about what you did to solve the issue. You talk about how you felt, etc. Be vulnerable, be open, and the person venting to you will respond similarly. Finally,

3) Ask "So what are you gonna do about it?" This kinda turns its head on the status-quo. Usually, this is the time you start explaining "Well here's what I did in my situation!" But that's not what you want here. Instead, you're asking the person if they've thought of a plan to tackle the issue. If you've established a "safe space" to discuss the topic, they feel more open about sharing their plan to resolve the problem, even if they don't have a plan and have to come up with it on the spot. Then, more likely than not, they'll ask "What do you think?"

At this point, you're free to let your problem-solving self run wild, assuming that you don't then consider your friend/colleague a "broken piece of code begging to be fixed."

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