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New York City is a mall

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Re: New York City is a mall

#41

Post by eatonphil »

cylinder wrote: post #18
hacknat wrote: post #9

I have to say that I feel bad for New Yorkers. I live in the middle of the country, but I work for a company on the lower east-side. I’m often in Manhattan, so I think I have a feel for what it’s like there and there is such a poverty of what a global city could be there. I’ve seen quite a bit of the world and dense Spanish urban centers are much better than Manhattan. Barcelona has created super blocks, which are th…

Lived in NYC (Manhattan and Brooklyn) five years, experienced highs and lows, started a business, closed one, took a traditional job and contract jobs, so I saw a lot. it's extremely overrated and overhyped. Lots of good, interesting people, but also lots of pretty awful ones (usually from somewhere else). Ultimately, the quality of life is poor and even London is far more livable than New York. Edit: the rapid downv…

I've lived/worked here for two years now. I moved (and stayed) for three reasons:

1) Top-tier companies to work for (second only to SF)

2) Top-tier arts/culture/park systems (second to none)

3) Wife is Korean and this is the place she's felt most safe walking alone on the street in the US (having previously lived in the Philly suburbs, Philly, and LA).

3b) Extremely multi-cultural and accepting. "Accepting" as in no one cares about anyone, which can be paradoxically nice. (second to none)

We couldn't find a city that improved on these trade-offs elsewhere in the US. Actually we've had a hard time finding places with better trade-offs anywhere else in the world (Toronto is a good candidate). But I want to work outside North America sometime.

We pay for it in the insane rents.

Re: New York City is a mall

#42

Post by cylinder »

jhatemyjob wrote: post #37
cylinder wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lived in NYC (Manhattan and Brooklyn) five years, experienced highs and lows, started a business, closed one, took a traditional job and contract jobs, so I saw a lot. it's extremely overrated and overhyped. Lots of good, interesting people, but also lots of pretty awful ones (usually from somewhere else). Ultimately, the quality of life is poor and even London is far more livable than New York. Edit: the rapid downv…

Would you recommend someone live there for a year or two? Kinda tired of the bay area

Personally I'd rather experience living somewhere in Europe for a year or two. See if you can pull that off.

Certainly no harm done living in NYC for two years especially if you come with a job lined up. It will definitely make you a bit more street smart and more adaptable, I think. As far as settling down permanently and raising a family, nope.

One good thing is that living in NYC, for the first time I didn't feel like a minority. It's so different to most of the rest of the US. There is no majority "in charge" of the place. I think that was an important experience for me.

I don't regret living there, but I wish I left sooner.

Edit: if your career is, and always will be, extremely important to you, and you have a good position with lots of potential to move up, and you are workaholic type, you will probably love it.

Re: New York City is a mall

#43

Post by adamsea »

kortilla wrote: post #31
danceparty wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Subjective and frankly insane to say. Over 8 million people live in NYC (over 2x the population of the next most populous city in the USA, Los Angeles). NYC is commonly known in western culture as a world capital of culture, finance, and world politics (recall the UN). The population of NYC has grown by over 223,615 since the previous census. I agree with you that other cities around the world (a very large area!) ma…

> NYC is commonly known in western culture as a world capital of culture, finance, and world politics Commonly known in NYC maybe. That view is antiquated in the rest of the US. > USA to be worthy of your sympathy based on their choice to live there is not constructive, nor rational. Wow, so sensitive. The pity is not because of their choice. It’s for how the urban planning of NYC has been consistently squandered for…

> Commonly known in NYC maybe. That view is antiquated in the rest of the US.

Respectfully, I doubt it. People may not _like_ NYC, but ...

- Wall Street - Carnegie Hall -MOMA, etc - As the other poster mentioned, the U.N. - Still tons of movies and shows use NYC as the setting for their story - Broadway, and theatre in the US - A huge part of the publishing industry is in NYC - Along with LA, Nashville, and Atlanta, NYC is one of the hearts of the US music industry.

And I’m sure there’s plenty I missed that we all could add to the list given a little time.

Those all seem like pretty obvious and objective markers identifying NYC as a US, if not world cultural, financial, and political hub.

Re: New York City is a mall

#44

Post by moogleii »

cylinder wrote: post #27
o_____________o wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> pretty awful [people] (usually from somewhere else). This is a strange assertion. What do you mean by this? Are you regurgitating the standard complaint about (white, midwest) transplants? From what I've seen over the years, most of the hyper-aggressive ding dongs are braying and bleating with thick, native NY/NJ accents.

No, I'm not. I'm more referring to the money-chaser Type As who come from around the world to hustle there, and yes I'd count NJ as somewhere else, as well as Long Island.

One of the things I love about NYC is how diverse it is both in people and industry. I don’t really know many finance types (at least assuming they are how they’re stereotyped); my social cross section seems to be tech, education, art, and law, so I guess I managed to miss that part of your experience.

Otherwise, my experience has largely been the opposite. I’ve worked with expats from Japan and Europe, and most of them love it here. Most of the Japanese folks actually chose to bypass the West coast entirely, having never been there, and came straight to NYC. One described it as “the future” in terms of diversity.

But yeah, it’s a big city, and I see shitty behavior all the time, so I’m not surprised by your experience.

Re: New York City is a mall

#45

Post by [deleted] »

brenden2 wrote: post #4

FWIW I live in Manhattan and I actively avoid these places. They are mostly packed with tourists, I doubt many locals spend time there. I've never been to Hudson Yards intentionally (I've walked past it before) and I don't plan on going. There's lots of good stuff in NYC if you're not a tourist, and it's very far from being a mall.

[deleted]

Re: New York City is a mall

#46

Post by seltzered_ »

Surprised the article didn't also mention the megamall "American Dream Meadowlands" (just west of Manhattan in New Jersey) which recently opened after over a decade involving bankruptcy, and a 2011 roof collapse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Dream_Meadowlands

edit: article written in June 2019, Meadowlands opened in October 2019.

Re: New York City is a mall

#47

Post by devnulloverflow »

kenhwang wrote: post #39
Sukotto wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Just look at Tokyo ... Every major transport hub is filled with shopping and food. They are designed that way. New transit construction is often the result of a joint venture between a rail company and one or more shopping construction companies / real estate companies. They work together to identify where they can profitably build a new station, with attached (or nearby) shopping + residences. Then work with financ…

Point is, they wouldn't design them that way if it didn't work or if people didn't like them. Retail works best when it's convenient. Classic American malls were not. Cities are designed too. Why don't we design them to be desirable places to be?

Because in America these things are designed by zoning and the political process. What you describe in Japan sounds like the Horrors of Captialism and can't possibly be allowed in America.

(Except I suppose it does happen, since the whole point of the article is that NYC does it).

Re: New York City is a mall

#48

Post by devnulloverflow »

cylinder wrote: post #17

Sounds like Westfield Bondi Junction. Most space used effectively. Large supermarkets in the mall. Cafes in the open corridor space. Intentionally confusing to get around. Btw, do American shops have parents rooms yet?

Now you are confusing me, because in Australia "mall" means something else -- and in Bondi Junction there's a mall right outside the Westfield.

I had some visitors from from Washington DC recently. They were impressed at how much more "happening" the local shopping centre (Hornsby Westfield) was compared to American malls. I suspect Westfield is a bit of a world-leader in this business.

Re: New York City is a mall

#49

Post by akdas »

jdlyga wrote: post #3

A good mall really is designed to be like a city. It's an interesting comparison. I noticed the same thing when I moved to Manhattan from the suburbs. Not just the proximity to retail stores (I live a half a block away from a Lululemon), but the dedication to a shared public space, and being around so many other pedestrians.

It sounds you may already know this, but for those who don't: malls were originally designed to be small cities. The inventor of the shopping mall, Victor Gruen, envisioned a structure with housing, medical centers, post offices, in addition to shopping. The idea was to mimic what his birthplace of Vienna already had: a mixed-use center not dominated by cars the way American suburbs are.

99% Invisible has a great episode about it: https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/the-gruen-effect/

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