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Uber Q3 Results

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Re: Uber Q3 Results

#101

Post by vladimir_prus »

malandrew wrote: post #85
Animats wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's about right. Running a fleet of autonomous vehicles is an expensive proposition, and probably will be for years after they start working. Waymo outsources some of that to Avis Rent-A-Car, which already has garages, maintenance facilities, parking lots, car washes, etc. It's quite possible that when automomous vehicle operations start working, the big players will be car rental companies. It's a natural extensi…

I have a hard time believing that anyone on HN legitimately things that companies like Hertz and Avis will be able to become efficient in the ridesharing market before one of the two TNCs become efficient in the fleet management market (which is a subset of the rental car market that overlaps with TNCs once they choose to have their own fleet. One set of businesses here has modern engineering practices and the other…

I would not be so sure. Avis, in particular, is actively pushing for a flow where you book online, use "secret" promo code to get full insurance for basically zero, pick up car directly on parking lot with keys inside, and drive away. It takes literally 5 minutes and a single employee to check your driving license and contract. Hertz is trying to do same, though less effectively. Their websites and apps are still horrible, and it's perplexing why, but the cost of building decent apps will be immaterial compared to the cost of the vehicles, and from that, building actual on-demand short-term rental network does not seem so unlikely.

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#102

Post by greggman2 »

arcticbull wrote: post #96
greggman2 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I switched to Lyft a few years ago because of Uber's evil ways. I've had zero problems. If people won't stop using a company that is so blatantly bad we're in trouble.

Frankly they're basically interchangeable. I'm not sure what you mean by a company "so blatantly bad" -- most of the drivers in SF at least drive for both Uber and Lyft. You can use either app and end up with the same driver, in the same car, offering the same exact experience at a practically indistinguishable price point. Uber at least seems to know people are mad at them and offer excellent customer service. Now,…

By bad I meant doing bad things uber has done.

https://www.google.com/search?q=bad+things+uber+has+done

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#103

Post by thecupisblue »

mikemotherwell wrote: post #62
henrikschroder wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Uber has only made finding the ride more efficient but it has not made the actual ride itself more efficient. Back when Uber was new and everyone in SF was exclaiming how awesome it was and disruptive, one of the major taxi companies in Stockholm launched a new version of their app that basically had a big button going "I want a taxi to my location now", and you pressed it, and you got a "Hey, your taxi will arrive…

There are way more positives than that: # No money changes hands, so safer for drivers. # No payment is made in the vehicle, so faster exit times. # Uber records all trips, so easier to work out costs to expense. # Uber uses any credit card, so your boss can pay for your ride without the need for separate expensing. # Driver and passenger are tracked, so there it is easy to find who did what. There are a lot of rape…

It's all an Uber illusion:

# No money changes hands, so safer for drivers.

Not true in many countries where cash is supported in Uber.

# No payment is made in the vehicle, so faster exit times.

Not true in many countries where cash is supported in Uber.

# Uber uses any credit card, so your boss can pay for your ride without the need for separate expensing.

I wouldn't do that a lot of times - I switched a few cards on my Uber account and had to contact support a lot of times because they froze all my payment options after that. Imagine being in the middle of US as European then getting all of your cards declined by Uber because you added your friend's card.

# Rating - I've been in a LOT of awful, awful cabs.

And I've been in a lot of awful ubers - the rating system doesn't work unless people actually do rate drivers, and people don't rate as much as you think. Also, if you don't want a driver but there isn't many drivers online, you keep getting reconnected to him even after canceling and selecting it's because of the driver multiple times.

# Drivers can work 1 hour and make some money. Try that with any other job.

Not really, the amount they earn in that 1 hour - when you remove Uber's cut, tax cut, gas and vehicle amortisation is terribly low. Some say they barely make ends meet with 8 hours driving.

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#104

Post by ganitarashid »

There's another thing that needs to be said. Uber is receiving a lot of criticism here, but whether they eventually make it as a company or not, Uber is doing one important thing: Showing that a business model and profits matter. This has been neglected in the last decade or so. If bringing back that awareness is Uber's only contribution, then no matter the company's outcome, it will have done a good thing.

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#105

Post by pif »

ganitarashid wrote: post #17

Having new “one-time” charges every quarter means those are not one-time charges. They’re part of the business, which means the business doesn’t work. One of Ubers biggest problems is that they have zero brand loyalty. For a company that sells a utility (get me, or my food, from A to B) rather than an experience (like a cool vacation in a unique mansion), I will always pick the cheapest option. Whether that’s Uber or…

> For a company that sells a utility (...) rather than an experience (...), I will always pick the cheapest option.

That's exactly how they built their business. They should not be surprised of the consequences!

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#106

Post by JimmyAustin »

thecupisblue wrote: post #103
mikemotherwell wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are way more positives than that: # No money changes hands, so safer for drivers. # No payment is made in the vehicle, so faster exit times. # Uber records all trips, so easier to work out costs to expense. # Uber uses any credit card, so your boss can pay for your ride without the need for separate expensing. # Driver and passenger are tracked, so there it is easy to find who did what. There are a lot of rape…

It's all an Uber illusion: # No money changes hands, so safer for drivers. Not true in many countries where cash is supported in Uber. # No payment is made in the vehicle, so faster exit times. Not true in many countries where cash is supported in Uber. # Uber uses any credit card, so your boss can pay for your ride without the need for separate expensing. I wouldn't do that a lot of times - I switched a few cards on…

> Not true in many countries where cash is supported in Uber.

I've taken Ubers in at least 7 countries, many of which have had a cash option (India and Vietnam), neither of which I took up. The average uber driver will have considerably less cash on them then the average cabbie.

> No payment is made in the vehicle, so faster exit times.

Only if you pay in cash.

> Uber uses any credit card, so your boss can pay for your ride without the need for separate expensing.

Uber supports having both a business and personal profile, which you can change before or during a ride. Every business uber I take has the receipt sent directly to my work email, and charged to my work CC.

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#107

Post by mytailorisrich »

treis wrote: post #12
heyflyguy wrote: post #11

I'd love to hear some smart people opinions on this idea: "Uber doesn't need to be profitable, they just need to survive until their autonomous cars are deployed"

IMHO, autonomous cars actually breaks Uber's model. It changes it from taking a % off the top of a market to a capital and maintenance intensive business. Only seems to work if they end up with some sort of franchise model. Sort of like how Coke has a bunch of distributors.

The upside is that they keep 100% of fares, benefit from the economies of scale of having a large fleet, and can run the cars 24/7.

Cars can be leased, reducing capex, and maintenance can be handled by specialised companies.

Overall it seems that this upside far outweighs the downside.

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#108

Post by [deleted] »

te_chris wrote: post #92
ganitarashid wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are all great things. And all of them are done by the competitors. In Europe I use MyTaxi, same thing as Uber but much nicer cars

You mean FreeNow or whatever... Don't understand that rebrand at all, MyTaxi is a great name. Not sexy or enigmatic, but it's a challenger brand.

[deleted]

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#109

Post by nabla9 »

mikemotherwell wrote: post #62
henrikschroder wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Uber has only made finding the ride more efficient but it has not made the actual ride itself more efficient. Back when Uber was new and everyone in SF was exclaiming how awesome it was and disruptive, one of the major taxi companies in Stockholm launched a new version of their app that basically had a big button going "I want a taxi to my location now", and you pressed it, and you got a "Hey, your taxi will arrive…

There are way more positives than that: # No money changes hands, so safer for drivers. # No payment is made in the vehicle, so faster exit times. # Uber records all trips, so easier to work out costs to expense. # Uber uses any credit card, so your boss can pay for your ride without the need for separate expensing. # Driver and passenger are tracked, so there it is easy to find who did what. There are a lot of rape…

The payment is non-issue in countries with mobile pay. Or payment using contactless chip without PIN for small charges. Soon non-issue everywhere. All those other things are in apps that modern taxicabs use.

Re: Uber Q3 Results

#110

Post by pavlov »

greggman2 wrote: post #70
cavisne wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least for me uber has huge brand loyalty, it’s sitting in the dock of my iPhone. If I need to go somewhere, or get home, Uber has never let me down. Likewise with food delivery, I certainly have been let down on that but Uber does the best job of letting me track the order and get a refund if needed. Sure Lyft is an alternative, I have it on my phone but simply never use it. It’s incorrect that nothing has changed…

I switched to Lyft a few years ago because of Uber's evil ways. I've had zero problems. If people won't stop using a company that is so blatantly bad we're in trouble.

For the past 25 years there has constantly been at least one tech company which is perceived in techie forums as so bad that it's incredible anyone would voluntarily use their products.

Those companies have been Microsoft, Apple, Google, Facebook and Amazon.

Financially you could have done amazingly well in the stock market simply by buying whatever big stock techies hate at the moment.

(Not saying Uber will necessarily continue this pattern. Even though they have the brand, I don't see how they intend to fix the enormous losses. That's very different from the optimized zero profit Amazon was making for years.)

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