Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project • Hacker News Board

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#311

Post by vertex-four » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 3:03 PM UTC

repolfx wrote: post #244

vertex-four wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook can have an internal payment system that uses local currencies. There is no reason it needs to create its own currency, except as a power grab. Building out a Paypal clone is fine enough.

How can it be a power grab, Libra was going to be at least an open system with it's own wallet protocols and market for implementations. A WeChat style system would be totally closed from the ground up.

No, it was going to be open to partners that Facebook picks and chooses. It was very specifically not to be a fully decentralised blockchain, which essentially means it's actually a big permissioned database, which the database owners get to control.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#312

Post by BubRoss » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 3:44 PM UTC

zanny wrote: post #75

BubRoss wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about using your money electronically without permission from a large organization?

The large organizations you want to do business with want confidence provided by large organizations as to the authenticity of your transactions and the legitimacy of your payment method. Practically every store that took bitcoin used bitpay as an intermediary so they never actually held any btc. They just had someone else turn it into USD and send them the money.

That is completely different. Someone paying to those places could do it without permission, you are talking about the places recieving.

Also those businesses also didn't need to use bitpay to receive anything but they could for convenience.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#313

Post by jrochkind1 » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 3:49 PM UTC

antihero wrote: post #296

wallace_f wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you really think if the internet was architected by politicians or corporate suits rather than 'some nerds with power'that it would have turned out better?

No, but let's not conflate the internet and currency/

Wait, aren't you the first one to do that in your first comment in this thread?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#314

Post by capableweb » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 4:44 PM UTC

grey-area wrote: post #298

lmm wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're imagining a mutual organisation of millions of people who are theoretically on equal standing and have a say in governance as far as possible, wouldn't that look rather like a state? What's the practical distinction you're drawing between a cooperative mutual organisation and a state?

You don't get to choose which state you belong to as chattel.

In general I guess you don't exactly get to choose willy-nilly which state you want to belong to, but you can make a choice to trying to get out of your current one, at least usually.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#315

Post by mmmBacon » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 4:44 PM UTC

lacker wrote: post #38

I hope this doesn't cause Facebook to give up on Libra. I personally have no desire to own Libra. But traditional bank accounts kind of suck as a product and I would like to see more tech companies competing with them. The problems with bank accounts: 1. They charge you fees for things 2. They try to upsell me stupid financial products 3. They are not easy to use in other countries 4. Typing in my credit card number…

I use a credit union. No fees. No hassle. I’ve been able to get money and pay for things using my credit union account on 5 different continents. The only exception is China where many places require Chinese credit cards. Solution: carry cash.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#316

Post by qwerty456127 » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 5:00 PM UTC

electriclove wrote: post #215

qwerty456127 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't insist on being sure it is actually going to work this way and Facebook isn't going to have the power over Libra yet the available concept says it's not meant to. Libra is meant to set you free (libre), not to be managed by Facebook or anybody. I am and many are totally sick of PayPal blocking accounts for no reason, requiring residence verification, charging ridiculous commissions, etc. Libra was supposed to…

We do, just not anything of the sort from Facebook.

Then who else? It can hardly be built and promoted efficiently without somebody big behind it. Which corporation would sound better than Facebook? Banks certainly are not better than Facebook - they have been tracking and limiting us for much longer than Facebook exists and they seemingly lack modern tech expertise as well as progressive attitude.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#317

Post by vinniejames » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 5:12 PM UTC

buboard wrote: post #270

vinniejames wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because politicians threatened them with increased regulatory scrutiny across all of their business

It s possible that the benefit would outweigh the risk - after all they are already in the payments busines and know how AML works etc. They 've done it for bitcoin. So, i would assume they were threatened a little less politely than i imagined.

It's possible yes, but why jeopardize the gold mine you already have in one of the most valuable tech startups?

Stripe ended Bitcoin support almost 2 years ago https://stripe.com/en-ee/blog/ending-bitcoin-support

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#318

Post by vinniejames » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 5:25 PM UTC

thefounder wrote: post #254

te_chris wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean like the eur, usd, aud, nzd, gbp, jpy? That sort of stable and reliable currency with a strong banking infrastructure?

Yeah except they are not digital currencies(i.e you cant store them on a cold wallet, you can't send or accept them without several 3rd parties involved(i.e paypal, visa, banks)

More importantly you can't travel with them without paying absurd exchange fees and aweful forex rates

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#319

Post by CaptainZapp » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 5:39 PM UTC

lacker wrote: post #38

I hope this doesn't cause Facebook to give up on Libra. I personally have no desire to own Libra. But traditional bank accounts kind of suck as a product and I would like to see more tech companies competing with them. The problems with bank accounts: 1. They charge you fees for things 2. They try to upsell me stupid financial products 3. They are not easy to use in other countries 4. Typing in my credit card number…

1. They charge you fees for things

Well, they provide a service and charge for that. Seems legit to me. Specifically in the context of European banks (including Iceland, Norway and Switzerland) that charge virtually nothing for basically instantaneous transfers within those countries. If US banks suck, maybe have a word with your congressperson.

2. They try to upsell me stupid financial products

If so, change your bank.

3. They are not easy to use in other countries

Uhh, just about any bank I know of issues an ATM card, which is either attached to the Plus, or Cirrus networks. My Swiss Postfinance ATM card work mighty fine at ATMs in Bangkok, Burundi, or Bangalore. Or just about in any damn place in the world. In other words: This reasoning is total bullshit.

4. Typing in my credit card number sucks

Yeah, well. You may prefer to trust a company, which lies a lot and shuts down your account for any and all resaon, without any recourse. Let alone get hold of a real life person to rectify the issue. Frankly, I prefer the "hardship" to type my credit card number (which I know by heart anyway) than to trust Mr. Zuckerberg or Mr. Marcus. Which, in my opinion, always seem pretty much full of shit whenever they open their mouth. To each his own, I guess.

5. Typing in my credit card number isn't secure

Er, not my problem. I let my bank sort that out. They're obliged to do that and whenever I had that (rare) problem it was sorted out in a jiffy. Best of luck sorting this out with just about any major tech company.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#320

Post by Zetaphor » Sat, Oct 12, 2019, 5:47 PM UTC

Notable that OP left Mercado Pago out of the headline, despite it being in the opening sentence. Mercado Pago is the largest payment provider in South America. In case you forgot, South America is the fourth largest continent and contains 12 countries.