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Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

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Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#81

Post by [deleted] »

capableweb wrote: post #56
CamelCaseName wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin can be "killed" in the sense that it can become useless for the 99.99%. Simply hunt down vendors who accept Bitcoin and organizations who facilitate its exchange. At that point, Bitcoin would be essentially dead as a rival to any currency.

> Simply hunt down vendors who accept Bitcoin and organizations who facilitate its exchange. This is commonly a argument for having drugs illegal too. "If we hunt them down, eventually there will be no one left" What we know now, is that making something illegal, could make it stronger. If Bitcoin becomes illegal in most country, would the price go up or down? Suddenly there is a black market, and opens up a whole ot…

[deleted]

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#82

Post by StevePerkins »

ilaksh wrote: post #37
StevePerkins wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt they were ever TRULY enthusiastic about this project, since its premise cuts into their primary bread-and-butter legacy business. I suspect their involvment was almost more of a " Keep your friends close and your enemies closer " sort of thing. The idea that it's better to be involved than shut out. But if I were them, I would be low-key thrilled that this is falling apart.

The primary threat for payment processors and fiat currency is real cryptocurrency. Libra is a fake cryptocurrency that the payment processors and governments hoped would help to hold off the cryptocurrencies for a few extra years. It would have allowed the payment processors to continue to profit from transactions and made it practical for governments to control payments and wallets. They are probably pulling out fo…

I'm sorry. Sometimes goldbugs, and the crypto hardcore, get pretty far out there on the edge. It can be confusing whether something is an interesting point, worthy of discussion... or just outright "alternative reality", like climate change denial, that you should walk away from.

Are you actually saying that:

1. The payment processors joined this consortium to AVOID helping crytocurrencies catch on in the mainstream?

2. The payment processors are lying about pulling out. Facebook secretly pushed them out, because Facebook wants to start over with a more "pure" cryptocurrency?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#83

Post by throwaway2048 »

lucasverra wrote: post #55

David Marcus update [1] : Special thanks to @Visa and @Mastercard for sticking it out until the 11th hour. The pressure has been intense (understatement), and I respect their decision to wait until there’s regulatory clarity for @Libra_ to proceed, vs. the invoked threats (by many) on their biz. I would caution against reading the fate of Libra into this update. Of course, it’s not great news in the short term, but i…

This is good for libra(coin)?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#84

Post by ttul »

justinzollars wrote: post #3

I'm actually kind of bummed out about this. I may not like FB, but I like the idea of a digital currency backed by a floating basket of currencies.

Then let’s have the central banks of the G7 set up a cryptocurrency that’s backed by actual reserve currency. Why put Facebook in the middle?

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#85

Post by rocqua »

capableweb wrote: post #56
CamelCaseName wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin can be "killed" in the sense that it can become useless for the 99.99%. Simply hunt down vendors who accept Bitcoin and organizations who facilitate its exchange. At that point, Bitcoin would be essentially dead as a rival to any currency.

> Simply hunt down vendors who accept Bitcoin and organizations who facilitate its exchange. This is commonly a argument for having drugs illegal too. "If we hunt them down, eventually there will be no one left" What we know now, is that making something illegal, could make it stronger. If Bitcoin becomes illegal in most country, would the price go up or down? Suddenly there is a black market, and opens up a whole ot…

Thing is, people have 'good reason' to want drugs: They feel good, and mostly, people get addicted. Moreover, there is much less of a scale requirement for drugs. It is pretty easy to make money on drugs when 0.1% of all people are using your drugs.

Whereas, a currency used by 0.1% of your friends / neighbors is totally useless.

These reasons make it 1) easier to suppress a currency 2) harder to suppress drugs.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#86

Post by hinkley »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #61
lacker wrote: post #38

I hope this doesn't cause Facebook to give up on Libra. I personally have no desire to own Libra. But traditional bank accounts kind of suck as a product and I would like to see more tech companies competing with them. The problems with bank accounts: 1. They charge you fees for things 2. They try to upsell me stupid financial products 3. They are not easy to use in other countries 4. Typing in my credit card number…

Do you really think a Facebook currency is not going to charge fees and upsell you left, right and centre the first moment they think they can get away with it? That's as well as targeting advertising and selling data of your spending patterns.

Pretty much my feeling.

I can never tell when discussing matters like this if the other party is expressing legitimate concerns poorly considered, or if I’m witnessing some astroturfing campaign.

JBoss was the first astroturfing campaign I learned about (and if you’re reading this, Marc, fuck you. Yeah people still remember.)

I know these sorts of things have been going on forever but it feels like it’s getting worse over time. To the point I’m not sure I know who to believe anymore.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#87

Post by Andrew_nenakhov »

mamon wrote: post #63
pat87 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin can be killed by means other than technological. For example it can be outlawed. Sure, people would still be able to use it, but they would be breaking the law and that would deter many, possibly enough to kill it outright.

Bitcoin does not need to be killed because it’s dead already: proved to be useless for all practical purposes, now used mostly for money laundering or other criminal activities

Money laundering and other criminal activities are a very profitable businesses that power an important sector of economy. If Bitcoin enables or facilitates them, it is far from what I would call useless.

Also: it will not be outlawed everywhere, some country will jump on the opportunity. So you earn bitcoins in one place, legalize then in another one, where it is legal. It's not so easy to prevent this, I'd even call an attempt futile.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#88

Post by hos234 »

lucasverra wrote: post #55

David Marcus update [1] : Special thanks to @Visa and @Mastercard for sticking it out until the 11th hour. The pressure has been intense (understatement), and I respect their decision to wait until there’s regulatory clarity for @Libra_ to proceed, vs. the invoked threats (by many) on their biz. I would caution against reading the fate of Libra into this update. Of course, it’s not great news in the short term, but i…

"Too big to innovate"

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#89

Post by xabotage »

CodiePetersen wrote: post #54

I'm actually glad it's dead/dying. It was always going to be controlled by an elite group who answered to no one but themselves. They had the ability to monitor all of your transactions and if they didn't like you they could roll back or block your transactions. People keep saying oh this is proof crypto can't ever work because government. This was never a true crypto currency. It was just a private ledger tracking w…

>They had the ability to monitor all of your transactions and if they didn't like you they could roll back or block your transactions.

Unlike, what, my established credit card company which still blocks me randomly when I'm traveling overseas even when I explicitly call their 800 hotline, sit on hold for 30 minutes, and tell some unempathetic worker "I'm overseas, don't block me"? Yes, thank goodness libra is dying, otherwise there might actually be some innovation against the exact things you just mentioned which perfectly describe the current state of affairs.

(Edit) I think it's fair to not trust Facebook with your currency, but keep in mind the players in the current system (governments, Banks, and credit companies) have hardly proven more trustworthy.

Re: Visa, Mastercard, Stripe, and eBay exit Facebook’s Libra project

#90

Post by hos234 »

jeremyjh wrote: post #31

It looks like a misstep followed by a hasty and ignominious retreat because thats exactly what happened - no one anticipated the reaction from lawmakers and rules agencies. Its kind of hard to see this from the perspective of people who follow tech and HN, but Libra really may have been the first occasion that the possibility of crypto as anything other than an investment instrument - e.g. an actual usage as currency…

So you are saying Facebook should declare itself as a (virtual) country and then try?
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