Why American Mothers are Superior • Hacker News Board

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#41

Post by gaoshan » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 2:28 AM UTC

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #21

gaoshan wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>because (apparently) this style of parenting is common. It is not common. Every Chinese mother I know (that would be quite a few) found the Amy Chua article to be repulsive. Just like the American moms did, except that they knew people would equate them with Chua's ideas so it makes them even angrier. My own wife (a Chinese mom) and her friends and relatives have been circulating the Chua article and talking about i…

Really? Asian Moms aren't like that? Anecdotally, let me assure you that my son's high school is full of them. All but one of the best musicians are Asian. All the best mathematicians are Asian. These young folks have little life outside of lessons and competitions. All those 'quite a few' Chinese mothers you know, you said were repulsed. But how many of them fit the description?

As extreme as Chua is in the article? No. They are certainly strict especially when compared to the stereotypical "white" mother, but not like Chua.

I have to admit, most (not all) of the Chinese moms I know are rather more liberal and open-minded about child rearing. Still much more grade/achievement focused than most American moms I know, but not as extreme as this Chua woman. I mean, even the more strict Chinese moms in my social circles wouldn't prevent their kids from attending sleep overs, as one example. Yes the kids study a lot (and do test prep plus attend Chinese school on weekends) and play an instrument (with much longer practice times than one might expect) and would be chewed out for anything less than an A (A- for the easy going moms) but still... not as draconian and goal oriented as Chua is portrayed the article.

With one mom in particular, who is one of the more disgusted with this article (she called the other day and we spent a good half hour talking about the WSJ article), I know her sons consider her a pretty typical "chinese mother", and probably moan about her to their friends (I'm their uncle/godparent, btw), and while she is strict and expects a lot she is still nothing as bad as the caricature in that article.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#42

Post by angrycoder » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 3:03 AM UTC

angdis wrote: post #3

I'm convinced the original article by the Chinese mother was some kind of satire. I simply can't believe a reasonably intelligent person (a Yale prof!) can write that with a straight face-- the bit about not letting kids participate in school plays takes the cake.

The had the woman who wrote the book on NPR today, it actually sounds like a very honest and interesting book. It is funny that what people are responding to with so much furvor is the Murdoch cliff's notes version of the story.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#43

Post by stretchwithme » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 3:05 AM UTC

Following your passion HAS to be better than following Mommy's socially-determined passion. The latter is, most likely, not even right for the mom, let alone the child.

But say we all became masters of the piano or violin. How could any of them make a living at it with such an oversupply?

I also wonder if the mothers of those who brought China its Cultural Revolution were of this superior variety.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#44

Post by istjohn » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 4:15 AM UTC

tomjen3 wrote: post #28

dkl wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really love this guy's writing. He cuts through the layers of BS so well and exposes something closer to root causes better than anyone I've ever seen.

Its pretty damn good, but the author is a she.

No, it's definitely a he.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#45

Post by zasz » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 4:24 AM UTC

mindblink wrote: post #39

bhousel wrote: post #4

Also worth reading is The Last Psychiatrist's response to the Chinese mothers article: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2011/01/why_chinese_mothers_a...

I don't really agree with her response. Her critique that the singular goal of this parenting style is to get kids into a good college. To me, it seems like Chua's approach is to prepare her kids to have the skills (focus/discipline) to be successful in life. The blog's critique seems to be missing the point. The post could argue why Chua doesn't instead prepare her kids for blue collar skills, which would be the big…

The Last Psychiatrist is a hard-drinking, womanizing man.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#46

Post by zasz » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 4:28 AM UTC

gaoshan wrote: post #41

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Asian Moms aren't like that? Anecdotally, let me assure you that my son's high school is full of them. All but one of the best musicians are Asian. All the best mathematicians are Asian. These young folks have little life outside of lessons and competitions. All those 'quite a few' Chinese mothers you know, you said were repulsed. But how many of them fit the description?

As extreme as Chua is in the article? No. They are certainly strict especially when compared to the stereotypical "white" mother, but not like Chua. I have to admit, most (not all) of the Chinese moms I know are rather more liberal and open-minded about child rearing. Still much more grade/achievement focused than most American moms I know, but not as extreme as this Chua woman. I mean, even the more strict Chinese m…

Well, I'll counter your anecdotal Chinese mothers with mine. I didn't get to do sleepovers, ever, and my parents drove over to pick me up from school if they thought I was spending too much time on extracurriculars and not working on math homework. It was pretty fucking humiliating.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#47

Post by gaoshan » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 4:34 AM UTC

zasz wrote: post #46

gaoshan wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As extreme as Chua is in the article? No. They are certainly strict especially when compared to the stereotypical "white" mother, but not like Chua. I have to admit, most (not all) of the Chinese moms I know are rather more liberal and open-minded about child rearing. Still much more grade/achievement focused than most American moms I know, but not as extreme as this Chua woman. I mean, even the more strict Chinese m…

Well, I'll counter your anecdotal Chinese mothers with mine. I didn't get to do sleepovers, ever, and my parents drove over to pick me up from school if they thought I was spending too much time on extracurriculars and not working on math homework. It was pretty fucking humiliating.

Your anecdotal Chinese mother is more extreme than my anecdotal Chinese mothers. Unfortunate.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#48

Post by richcollins » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 5:02 AM UTC

wintyfresh wrote: post #36

I'm writing this from Hong Kong, where I run a scholarship for young entrepreneurs in mainland China. A few thoughts: -To understand the mentality of a Chinese parent, you need to know a few things. First, the obvious one child policy, and the expectation that this one child will support their children but also their parents and grandparents (no social security, minuscule pensions and a non-existent safety net). This…

None of that speaks to her criticism of the practice of focusing on rote learning over creativity. I think you can make a good argument that a creative thinker is less likely to fall behind in the real world than someone that only takes the prescribed approach to solving problems.

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#49

Post by Herring » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 6:18 AM UTC

axod wrote: post #27

krschultz wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of articles have linkbait titles and promote books. Few resonate on here. That article resonated on here becuase a lot of people on the site are intimatedly familar with pros & cons of the style of mothership described in the book. I don't really see what point you are trying to make.

The point is "I never click ads! They're terrible only idiots click them!"... "Ooh an advert for a book "

We can't refuse to discuss social issues just because someone has written about them...

Re: Why American Mothers are Superior

#50

Post by blasdel » Sat, Jan 15, 2011, 6:30 AM UTC

cafard wrote: post #20

Here's a proposal, and it may come from having just glanced at The Last Psychiatrist blog: this year, the HN Lenten penance will be "no postings about education." Nothing about American schools awful; nothing about American schools actually not awful; nothing about college admissions; nothing about H d or S d or M*T. No Michelle Rhee, no Gates Foundation. Will it be good for your soul? Dunno, consult your local cleri…

Topic bans can be a godsend, especially on a site like this one with short-lived threads where it's even easier to repeat the same tiresome 'discussion' over and over.

In another community I frequented for years, the set of mostly-verboten topics grew to include stuff like cat declawing, ownership of TVs or SUVs, atheism, male circumcision, Israel / Palestine, and fiat currency.