Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app • Hacker News Board

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#421

Post by JohnBooty » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:19 PM UTC

echelon wrote: post #242

laingc wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, as an iOS user, I do not want the App Store opened up at all. Currently, I can go to the App Store, install any app, and be about 99.9% confident that the app will do me (or my technologically illiterate mother) absolutely no harm. This is something I value highly, and am happy to pay the “Apple premium” for.

I don't want to live in your locked-down Disney with the death sentence world. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. I want freedom and liberty to do what I want with the devices I own. I want to develop without fear that these two megacorps can shut me down on a whim for developing something against their ideology. The web isn't like that. Windows wasn't like that. Today we live in a Fischer-Pri…

    Windows wasn't like that.

Yeah, and it was an absolute disaster. Until very recently (Win7, roughly, or perhaps Vista) near every Windows install -- unless it had been locked down by an administrator, or maintained by a power user -- was an absolute cesspool of malware and outright spyware. The average Windows machine was literally unsafe to use.

    That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me.

Essentially what you're asking for is a return to the world where some of the most common consumer devices in the world could only be safely operated by power users. Except it would be even worse today, since smartphones are so much more essential and offer so much more information about us (biometrics, location services, mics, cameras, etc) that can be harvested and exploited.

I (a power user!) sort of miss those days too. It's not like I ever had malware.

But in general, that wasn't working.

What do you think about compromises (like macOS, and Android) where non-blessed software is disabled by default, but can fairly easily be sideloaded?

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#422

Post by Phillips126 » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:20 PM UTC

aurbano wrote: post #304

I ran a website that I first coded when I was 14-15, then kept improving over the years. It was for amateur electronic music producers to upload their tracks and after a few years there were several thousand active users, generating ~$400/month in AdSense. One day a relatively famous DJ tweeted a link to a song on the website, and that day alone generated close to $300, so 19 year old me thought he was about to earn…

I also developed a website young (mid teens), which was essentially a "beautiful/unique website ranking" based on visitor submissions and upvote/downvote system. I had the essential pieces done and launched the website, super excited as my first real project.

I decided to toss on Google AdSense to see if I could potentially monetize the website by putting a single picture advertisement on the right side of the website. I was starting to generate some money (small, but exciting for a young developer). I was talking to my high school friend about what I was doing and how AdSense worked. Unbeknownst to me, he later visited my website and clicked the ads repeatedly expecting to make me hundreds of dollars... well, my account was shut down.

I tried to plead my case, Google didn't care at all. I was "banned" and a small fish. Years later (in my early 20's) I considered revisiting the idea of monetizing a site I had for an online community. I tried to appeal to Google again lifting the ban and was denied.

I was effectively banned for life from using Google AdSense as a young teen because of a friend "trying to make me rich" without him knowing the repercussions. I know there are alternatives to Google AdSense, however, Google was the one that payed the best. Still irks me to this day when I think about it...

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#423

Post by ummonk » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:20 PM UTC

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #105

javert wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the U.S., phone providers are protected by the government. You can't compete with them. The government has basically granted them fiefs. I feel like cars are great. I don't know where the complaint is there. There is an enormous amount of variety in cars. It's really amazing. Definitely a triumph of capitalism. I also don't really have a problem with banks. There seems to be plenty of options. People mostly just c…

> I feel like cars are great This is myopic, to put it lightly. Toyota own the three brands that are the least costly cars to maintain, followed by Honda. BMW’s cost, on average, three times as much to maintain.[1] I own a VW because I’m an enthusiast, but I drive a Honda because I also need a reliable vehicle. Some BMWs should be regulated out of existence . Rang Rovers too. I work directly opposite my mechanic and…

The existence of garbage brands with terrible reputations that rich people are willing to pay for doesn't mean cars as a whole aren't great. There are of course great brands like Toyota or Honda out there, which most consumers prefer en masse.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#424

Post by dreamcompiler » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

xtacy wrote: post #419

dreamcompiler wrote: post #404

Google's App Store is failing miserably with both Type 1 (false negative) and Type 2 (false positive) errors. As a result, malware gets allowed in while reputable developers get kicked off. And there's apparently no (real) appeal process. Once the robot decides it doesn't like you, you can't change its mind and it won't tell you why. These problems are eminently fixable. But Google's app store desperately needs compe…

I think you meant to say -- Type 1 is a false positive, and type 2 is a false negative.

Yes. Thanks.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#425

Post by la_barba » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #267

eightysixfour wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Our client was perfectly reputable, ran multi million dollar ad campaigns on television and radio, and was FDA approved. I’m not trying to be a jerk here, but it sounds like your client is selling dietary supplements which Google has been (IMO rightfully) aggressively removing.

Yeah, that's what I got out of it too. As soon as I hit "FDA approved" I had to pause and consider that maybe Google isn't the bad guy here.

Being in the vaccine industry.. we take that term to mean reduced stress, back to normal life, and dollar signs.. :P

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#426

Post by ebg13 » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

eightysixfour wrote: post #394

eganist wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"FDA Approved" isn't a boogeyman term. It means the supplement was in fact reviewed/approved by the FDA, whereas dubious substances come with statements that their claims have not been FDA approved. Why the aversion to "FDA Approved"?

The FDA approves that ingredients are “safe” to consume but the label is often used to imply the FDA has approved the ingredient for whatever health claim the manufacturer has attached to the supplement. It is a boogeyman term not because of what it actually means but how it is leveraged to say something it doesn’t mean.

> The FDA approves that ingredients are “safe” to consume

Only for food and drug ingredients. The FDA has no such process for supplements. They FDA only evaluates supplement products after public health concerns arise from a product already on the market.

"FDA is not authorized to review dietary supplement products for safety and effectiveness before they are marketed.

If the dietary supplement contains a NEW ingredient, manufacturers must notify FDA about that ingredient prior to marketing. However, the notification will only be reviewed by FDA (not approved)"

https://www.fda.gov/food/buy-store-serve-safe-food/what-you-...

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#427

Post by notyourwork » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:24 PM UTC

echelon wrote: post #242

laingc wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, as an iOS user, I do not want the App Store opened up at all. Currently, I can go to the App Store, install any app, and be about 99.9% confident that the app will do me (or my technologically illiterate mother) absolutely no harm. This is something I value highly, and am happy to pay the “Apple premium” for.

I don't want to live in your locked-down Disney with the death sentence world. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. I want freedom and liberty to do what I want with the devices I own. I want to develop without fear that these two megacorps can shut me down on a whim for developing something against their ideology. The web isn't like that. Windows wasn't like that. Today we live in a Fischer-Pri…

The whole premise of mobile apps is flawed. It’s sad to me that we shifted away in favor of mobile installation and fragmented platforms.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#428

Post by pdkl95 » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:27 PM UTC

gargravarr wrote: post #370

pdkl95 wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (they are all scratched out as 'missing') The 'missing' notes are incredibly condescending. Not only are the results irrelevant/incorrect, they also had to arrogantly point out exactly how they are choosing to ignore the user's request.

Amen to that. I got to where I am as a sysadmin by knowing how to filter out keywords to make my search specific. Then Google throw all that away and decide for me what I want to search for. No Google, you don't tell me what to do.

Animaniacs Episode 7, "Piano Rag":

    [The Warners try to hide form Dr, Scratchandsniff in
     a piano recital, where Tymannini is about to perform]
  
    TYMP: Franz Schubert intended the scherzo
          to reflect the struggle between intellect
          and the creative process.
    TYMP: However, Schubert was simply incapable
          of expressing such delicate nuance.
          But, thanks to *my* genius,
          I will perform this great work,
          *not* as the composer wrote it,
          but as he *intended*.

DWIM ("Do What I Mean")[1] has always been impossible; it's a fallacious belief that what a user intended is different from what they actually said, and that this intent can somehow be divined form a few words, typos, etc.

> as a sysadmin

It doesn't even require any advanced technical knowledge. Most people understand basic keyword searching. Over the last ~6-12 months, I've seen a wide variety of people complain about Google ignoring their search terms.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15628014

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#429

Post by johneth » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:28 PM UTC

zaroth wrote: post #384

johneth wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Regulating the App Stores as some sort of utility sounds like the perfect way to stifle growth and make it more difficult and expensive to publish on the App Store Please explain how you've come to this conclusion, because I can't follow your logic.

It’s well established that regulations increase transaction costs and stifle innovation. Take FDA regulations for example. The cost of developing a drug for sale in the USA in orders of magnitude higher due to these regulations. In safety critical systems, we pay this cost because the alternative is that people die. However, even still, the regulatory system itself may also be responsible for many deaths, due to viab…

I think we have a different idea of what these hypothetical regulations would do.

I see it as regulations forcing Google and Apple, as platform owners, to not abuse their enormous power over developers on their platforms. Much like common-carrier regulations.

I don't see how that sort of regulation would massively increase costs to Google and Apple (who are profiting massively off their platforms anyway!)

I also don't agree that regulations on these platforms sounds horrific. I think just about anything is better than the power concentrated entirely at the whims of Google and Apple at the moment. Similarly, I don't think there'd be increased compliance cost to the platform. Regulation isn't always bad (in fact, I'd argue the vast majority of regulation is good, we just hear about the smaller amount of bad bits that slip through).

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#430

Post by la_barba » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:28 PM UTC

WorldMaker wrote: post #389

iamsb wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never been to silicon valley, so my knowledge about it is extremely limited. But last couple of years, I am hearing so many stories from big tech companies - from google to facebook to snapchat to uber - that I wonder if there is a big culture issue in valley based companies.

The way I've put it before, is that a culture issue (in something of a soup of them) is that "people" aren't an "interesting technology" that will, for instance, make HN headlines or provide interesting things for technologists to work on or brag about, so SV companies don't really invest in "people" to solve problems. SV companies under-value important labor roles like customer service, and instead over-value automa…

I think apart from the scale, they view labor as a risk, rather than an asset. The ironic part to me is they're hiring "genius" level talent to create these dummy level algorithms.