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Who Owns Huawei?

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Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#271

Post by jdietrich »

pcr910303 wrote: post #238
jdietrich wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's important to note that this deep integration of corporations and the state is by no means unique to China - to a great extent, Deng Xiaoping's modernization in the 1980s emulated the chaebol of South Korea and the Keiretsu of Japan. Korean and Japanese business is based on tacit relationships between extremely large vertically-integrated corporations and the state while China has more overt elements of a command…

> or the NIS want Samsung's data they just ask for it, on the understanding that a) they're not really in a position to say no and b) cooperation with the state is a mutually beneficial quid-pro-quo. Er... just to clarify: Samsung was deeply inter-wined with the government before(from the 80s to ~'17), I’m not sure if NIS has actually requested Samsung’s data but I suspect Samsung could give out such data. However mo…

South Korean companies undoubtedly have greater legal recourse to challenge the government, but I am unpersuaded that the chaebol exercise that right particularly often. The impeachment of president Park does indicate an appetite for change, but South Korea has a long history of corruption, cronyism and state-sanctioned monopoly abuse.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaebol#Criticism

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#272

Post by naiveai »

sudmh wrote: post #237
runn1ng wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The scary thing about Chinese approach is that it seems actually working.

Of course it works. It didn't work in the past because most autocracies were led by low IQ people. When you factor that out, you get a system that works.

I detect a not-so-subtle racist twinge in this comment...

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#274

Post by green-eclipse »

paganel wrote: post #219
jdietrich wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's important to note that this deep integration of corporations and the state is by no means unique to China - to a great extent, Deng Xiaoping's modernization in the 1980s emulated the chaebol of South Korea and the Keiretsu of Japan. Korean and Japanese business is based on tacit relationships between extremely large vertically-integrated corporations and the state while China has more overt elements of a command…

I feel that if the NSA were to ask for much of Google’s data right at this moment there isn’t anything Google could do, and I’m not even that sure that they would want to do anything. The same goes for FB. If they decide not to comply then both of these companies might risk being broken up or worse, so why risk it? The bottom line is that if you decide doing anything against the current US powers that be (like harass…

This is untrue. If the NSA could just ask Google for it's data, it wouldn't have had to create all the clandestine spying programs that it needed to steal the data from Google. Remember all the info we learned when the Snowden leaks came to light.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#275

Post by mattrp »

edejong wrote: post #223
paganel wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel that if the NSA were to ask for much of Google’s data right at this moment there isn’t anything Google could do, and I’m not even that sure that they would want to do anything. The same goes for FB. If they decide not to comply then both of these companies might risk being broken up or worse, so why risk it? The bottom line is that if you decide doing anything against the current US powers that be (like harass…

And we shouldn’t believe for a second this isn’t already happening with multiple three letter agencies.

Perhaps... but when you walk into a US company there’s typically not a “party” office on the first floor and I’m not talking about the place where everyone eats cake.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#277

Post by stordoff »

tthhuyid wrote: post #125
throw0101a wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ... overestimating the authoritarian. Sure: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinjiang_re-education_camps

For perspective, there are 2.3 million African Americans in prison.

> These camps are reportedly operated outside of the legal system; many Uyghurs have been interned without trial and no charges have been levied against them.

This is a fundamental difference (and yes, America has detained people indefinitely without trial, but I would condemn that _too_, and they are a small minority of prisoners).

Furthermore, there are ~2.3 million _people_ in prison, of which 40% are black (39% white, 19% Hispanic).

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#278

Post by stordoff »

heisenbit wrote: post #216
xster wrote: post #116

> • We know nothing about the internal governance procedures of the trade union committee. We do not know who the committee members or other trade union leaders are, or how they are selected. Well Huawei is pretty specific about the internal governance procedures of the trade union committee, who the committee members or other trade union leaders are, and how they are selected. https://imgur.com/a/mEFkgna It obviousl…

As a reader of an analyst report you expect facts. As a buyer you can choose either facts or fud.

Just to clarify, are you saying the Huawei claim is (potentially) FUD?

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#279

Post by dirtyid »

xxxpupugo wrote: post #255
ahartmetz wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"To protect freedom"? That is the US catch-all argument and doesn't really say much. Whose freedom, from / for what, and what about other factors? To me from Western Europe the state and corporations are... comparable to families and sports clubs. Nobody would want to merge them for tons of reasons including personal freedom (here: separation of public and private spheres), effectiveness, responsiveness, avoidance of…

> large Asian companies is that there is much less in-fighting between parts of the organization Not true. My observations are opposite, however, I am not disapproving what you said, but I don't think there is a conclusion to make. However, if you prove yourself as a capable strongman that doesn't take objections, then in Asian companies, under the certain circumstances/directives, I believe you can have much more di…

Video game crunch in western companies sounds comparably bad TBH. Search for all the drama around unending crunch hell of Fortnight development. If anything 997 seems to formalize and provide and at least provides upper limit on exploitation.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#280

Post by yourbandsucks »

antimora wrote: post #183
sprafa wrote: post #99

There’s also something the Chinese state calls “fusion centres” which is one of the most interesting facets of this intelligence-industrial complex in China. Essentially the state decides, let’s say high tech cutting edge batteries for storing renewable energy is where they want to invest in. They gather a few companies into a building that can do it or are interested. They then have state representatives who effecti…

This makes me think that the whole IP sharing/stealing is in the cultural fabric of Chinese business dealings. And it would be nearly impossible for Trump to fix it through his current trade negotiations.

Cultural schmultural. They're in a place where it makes sense to do it, they're pragmatic, they do it.

The US industrial revolution was kick-started by IP theft as well: https://www.history.com/news/industrial-revolution-spies-eur...

Would you do any different if you were in charge of a country and your people need to eat? "Sorry starving peasants, we must respect international IP law"?

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