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The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

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Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something can be both an expression of privilege and a very good idea. Example: The advice to get at least 8 hours of sleep at a regular time each night. This reflects: - the economic privilege of not needing to do irregular shift work - not having a chronic disease which interrupts sleep - not being a parent - having a regular place to sleep at all. However, it is still a good idea for one’s physical and mental heal…

Well, as I said, it shouldn't be ALWAYS allowed, otherwise you have that sect of people who bring up the politics inherent in anything, and while it's true and important, it's not what HN is about or should be about. BUT, and this is a big but here, there are a small number of discussions on HN where it can be argued that the politics involved in an issue are more important than the technology. Or, that the technolog…

Like 1st day of month are the hiring threads... what about on the 15th we have a very focused political debate - and no other threads are allowed to have it.

I definitely agree that tech lately is so intertwined with politics.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#272

Hacker News is a well-moderated community, but it's illustrative to see where Hacker News fails at moderation. While Hacker News is great at protecting the community from disruptive individuals, it tends to fall down when protecting unpopular individuals against the community turned mob. I support Hacker News moderating itself however it chooses. However, if we are looking at it as a moderation model for large, open,…

> Hacker News moderation is not appealable, not auditable, does not have bright line rules, and there are no due process rights. It simply does not respect individual rights.

I'm not sure I'd agree with this. An appeal is as easy as sending them an email. In my experience they're more than willing to hear you out.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is actually my sole complaint with HN. I love the community and I understand where the moderators are coming from, but I feel that it's important to point out that the position of "keep politics out of $X" is the purest expression of privilege, and in general is an attitude that embraces the status quo, no matter how horrifying it might be for the unprivileged. I'm not saying HN should allow ALL political discus…

Something can be both an expression of privilege and a very good idea. Example: The advice to get at least 8 hours of sleep at a regular time each night. This reflects: - the economic privilege of not needing to do irregular shift work - not having a chronic disease which interrupts sleep - not being a parent - having a regular place to sleep at all. However, it is still a good idea for one’s physical and mental heal…

This is, of course, what the word “privilege” means, both in the sociology context and in everyday language. It’s something good that is only available to certain people or groups.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#274

Since account creation was disabled, I'm sure it's the easiest moderation job going.

I always make a fresh new throwaway account here every time I make a post, and,so, by this post you can deduce yourself. This is a zero-minute account, as all my accounts are. You're welcome.

FYI: that's explicitly discouraged.

You're welcome to create throwaways where appropriate. But in doing what you're doing, you're very likely making it more difficult for those with a legitimate need to do similarly to do so.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#275
post #185

Hacker News is a well-moderated community, but it's illustrative to see where Hacker News fails at moderation. While Hacker News is great at protecting the community from disruptive individuals, it tends to fall down when protecting unpopular individuals against the community turned mob. I support Hacker News moderating itself however it chooses. However, if we are looking at it as a moderation model for large, open,…

> While Hacker News is great at protecting the community from disruptive individuals, it tends to fall down when protecting unpopular individuals against the community turned mob. Isn't every community -barring a few wild west's- like that? One Usenet, someone with an unpopular opinion would end up in people's kill file. On IRC, someone with an unpopular opinion would end up on people's ignore or would get kicked off…

Individuals putting someone on their personal ignore list is different from a moderator deciding to put someone on everybody's ignore list though.

Your solution is a bit lacking, I believe. "If it's not popular, it has no merit, because if it had merit it would be popular". There's also no telling whether some unpopular opinion you'd consider without merit today will become popular tomorrow (and, if history teaches us anything, we've been generally bad at predicting which will become popular, which will remain popular and which will fall out of favor), so it's somewhat silly to make hard judgements.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#276

This apologetic article changes nothing. The moderation of hackernews should be independently audited for biased censorship.

How would you propose doing that?

I've suggested some sort of transparency report. That wasn't warmly embraced, but a viable model might stil work.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious why you think "lots" of skilled, wealthy and powerful people frequent HN. I think its lots of people who think they are skilled and wish they were wealthy and/or powerful.

The heavy startup focus of hackernews (like, it's an incubator's news agitator) + lots of successful tech-types, like FAANG employees with 200K+ salaries. Lots of other commentators I've seen on here are experience pilots, engineers, etc. Maybe not Bill Gates money but certainly on the higher end of the bell-curve when it comes to education and pay. I don't disagree that there is a lot of aspirational talk on here to…

> like FAANG employees with 200K+ salaries.

At first I was a little amazed that many negative articles and comments about these companies were being down-voted, just notice the latest article on the status of a pregnant employee at Google, where the discussion's focus was very quickly and conveniently moved from how said employee had been mistreated by Google to how bad it is that Google allows its employees to discuss freely on these topics.

I didn't understand how come these companies have so many fans on this website, but then I realized that some of these users' total comp largely depends on how those companies' shares behave. If I'm not mistaken a FAANG engineer with 10 year of experience has his comp at about 200k in actual salary and the same figure in redeemable shares, so their total comp can approach 4-500k, half of it in shares. As such, it makes perfect sense to downvote everyone that says bad and unpleasant things about your company, because your money actually depends on it. Not sure that there's anything we, the non-FAANG employees, can do about that.

If it matters I've been an user of this website for quite some time, I just wanted to mention that I'm neither powerful nor wealthy.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#279

dang and sctb possess admirable patience and persistence but I've always enjoyed dang's posts when he participates in a conversation. I wonder if his time spent serving as a moderator somewhat robs hn of an especially thoughtful poster. Thanks guys.

dang does submit articles with some regularity. They're suprisingly rarely voted up, though as a reading queue are themselves very highly recommended by me.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News

#280
post #242

Has anyone ever seen an online community (with more than a handful of users) that focuses on more than cute puppy pictures and that is not described as "toxic" by "critics"? I'd say that HN does a great job at avoiding that. The article is titled "moderating hacker news" but fails to describe just how good a job the moderators and owners are doing. The moderators for moderation, and the owners for (as I perceive it)…

It's not up to The New Yorker to give praise to moderators or owners. That's inserting bias.

It's up to the readers (us) to determine whether the moderators are doing a good job.

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