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Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

gizmodo.com

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Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#91

Post by wpietri »

dmix wrote: post #89
wpietri wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree on the smug dick part, but is 3 really trivializing addiction? Or is it perhaps a useful counter to the egregious motivated reasoning that goes along with addiction? I certainly think we should be sympathetic with addicts and help them where we can. But I don't think that requires accepting the obvious bullshit that addicts come up with in justifying their behavior. And it's not like vaping is the only way to…

Another huge problem is people rarely accept the realities on the ground in these abstract debates. That people will continue to smoke cigarettes otherwise or find black market means to vape even when its heavily regulated or banned. As a consequence it simply pushes people into completely unsafe vendors and shady people, pushing good kids into the justice system, encouraging related criminal activity which black mar…

I agree with the general thrust of your point, but I'm not sure it applies here. People smoke weed because it's fun or because it is medically useful. But from the tobacco smokers and ex-smokers I know, that's never the case. It's not fun; it's a very hard-to-kick addiction.

It's also an addiction provided on a for-profit basis. That means strong incentives to create new addicts. I don't think it's at all unreasonable for us as a society to work against that.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#93

Post by ramblerman »

exogeny wrote: post #15

I sort of hate these articles, because the comments always boil down to three main categories: 1. I vape and this hasn’t happened to me, therefore I’m an expert on public health policy 2. I vape and because it’s better than cigarettes, it’s safe on those terms alone 3. What the hell is wrong with you idiots, safer than cigarettes is not the same as safe You’re either irrationally defensive (1, 2) because you feel att…

so adding more divisive comments, instead of discussing facts is the way to go?

The official recommendation from the NHS in the UK is now that vaping is indeed less harmful than cigarettes:

Public Health England's 2015 independent evidence review found that, based on the available evidence, vaping is around 95% less harmful than smoking. The Royal College of Physicians came to a similar conclusion in its 2016 report 'Nicotine without smoke: tobacco harm reduction'.

- https://www.nhs.uk/smokefree/help-and-advice/e-cigarettes

Perhaps we don't have enough data yet, but as a matter of public health policy it is definitely useful to know which is less harmful for you.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#94

Post by Ma8ee »

dmix wrote: post #89
wpietri wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree on the smug dick part, but is 3 really trivializing addiction? Or is it perhaps a useful counter to the egregious motivated reasoning that goes along with addiction? I certainly think we should be sympathetic with addicts and help them where we can. But I don't think that requires accepting the obvious bullshit that addicts come up with in justifying their behavior. And it's not like vaping is the only way to…

Another huge problem is people rarely accept the realities on the ground in these abstract debates. That people will continue to smoke cigarettes otherwise or find black market means to vape even when its heavily regulated or banned. As a consequence it simply pushes people into completely unsafe vendors and shady people, pushing good kids into the justice system, encouraging related criminal activity which black mar…

But that would force it into hiding. Much fewer people could run out for a short five minute vaping break in plain sight of everyone. So they’d save it for the evenings and their homes, which means they’d do it much more rarely, which means that much fewer people would get addicted. And nicotine as a drug isn’t all that fun.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#95

Post by hdfbdtbcdg »

sjaknanxnnx wrote: post #77
hdfbdtbcdg wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For each specific post you can't tell.

I have some friends who have said it to me in person too. I wonder which of them are the shills?

This had been flagkilled. I vouched it because it is a serious point.

None of them obviously. But the standards of trust I have in my friends is higher than in strangers.

I'm not certain that there really are paid shills on this particular topic online (I actually somewhat doubt it because it would open the companies up to serious legal issues). But we should always be aware that the interests of strangers may not align with ours.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#96

Post by JasonFruit »

grzm wrote: post #85
JasonFruit wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's a beer league?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_league

Ha! Stupid me thought it was some sort of a beer-lover's group in which the commenter hoped to improve his performance, a sort of organized pub crawl.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#97

Post by 9wzYQbTYsAIc »

dahfizz wrote: post #63
9wzYQbTYsAIc wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mitigating risk is what it is all about. Methadone is less risky than Heroin, which is why you can get a prescription for the one at a drug treatment facility but not the other.

> which is why you can get a prescription for the one And you can't buy either at a corner store. Methdone > heroin and vaping > cigarettes but we still should not encourage vaping. It is dangerous and we should treat it as such.

So is drinking alcohol, but you don’t see stop drinking commercials on TV.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#98

Post by dahfizz »

9wzYQbTYsAIc wrote: post #97
dahfizz wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> which is why you can get a prescription for the one And you can't buy either at a corner store. Methdone > heroin and vaping > cigarettes but we still should not encourage vaping. It is dangerous and we should treat it as such.

So is drinking alcohol, but you don’t see stop drinking commercials on TV.

Have you ever heard the phrase "please drink responsibily"?

Besides, it's a different issue. It is general knowledge that alcohol has some serious health consequences.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#99

Post by systematical »

mkl wrote: post #55
systematical wrote: post #50

Is their research on people who have ONLY vaped? Most people who vape are former/current smokers. For me, I vape when not drinking and smoke cigarettes when drinking. This means I smoke about 2-3 packs a month, the rest is vape. It's harm reduction for me and allows me to still perform at a reasonable cardio level in beer leagues. Now my evidence is shotty, but my lungs "feel" better and I have a noticeable improveme…

This reasoning seems pretty strange to me. Why not quit entirely?

Having quit smoking before for a year and vaping for 9 months. I had to entirely quit drinking to do it. I started drinking again. It's dumb, I know. I need to quit drinking for a few months again, taper down with vape like I did last time, and then just not pick up a smoke again. Instead, just use a vape when I'm drunk if I feel the need.

Re: Wisconsin Officials Urge People to Stop Vaping After Sudden Rise in Lung Disease

#100

Post by buttcoinslol »

WalterSear wrote: post #29
SynthCann wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting to see JWH discussed on HN. This stuff was BIGGG about a decade ago, and then I stopped hearing about it. It's crazy to see they are still playing the game of cat and mouse with these analogues, and even getting them into the black market carts. I have medical so thankfully I don't need to mess with the black market at this point. I would _highly_ advise against using any synthetic cannabinoids.

They aren't. Parent is misinformed.

I likely am, it was speculation on my part. Thank you for providing more concrete information, I should've noted that I was speculating.
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