Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone • Hacker News Board

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#161

Post by OrangeMango » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:35 PM UTC

kemiller2002 wrote: post #102

Funny story (well OK, not so funny), I worked at a company where the FBI decided to pay a visit and investigate some potential naughtiness performed by members of the senior staff. They asked questions such as "Do you use your cell phone and personal email for company matters." Guess what a lot of them said, "Yep, have to." That immediately made their personal equipment, etc. in scope for the investigation and they c…

If you use your home computer to RDP into your work computer, what would be the correct answer to the question? The "work" occurs on the company-owned computer, but you are typing on the keyboard of your personally-owned computer.

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#162

Post by guitarbill » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:35 PM UTC

wikibob wrote: post #127

supergeek133 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No joke, we recently went to a BYOD model with no "assistance". I'm expected to be available 24/7 in most cases. So I'm refusing to be available until I get some compensation.

It's a very competitive labor market. For employers. If you are highly skilled, you are highly in demand. Therefore, demand good treatment. Tech industry compensation has never been higher: http://levels.fyi/comp.html Google pays for on-call hours. You are credited with 33.3% time for each hour on call if you have a 30 minute response requirement, and 66.6% time for each hour on call if you have a 5 minute response r…

The really dumb thing is paying for overtime works great. Some younger employees want to do it for the extra cash or vacation for a longer holiday. I know there were times I wanted to work on a holiday day/bank holiday to save up time in lieu.

The problem is companies where default on-call becomes part of the culture. They also have little incentive to fix terrible ops. I hear AWS can be like this, depending on the service.

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#163

Post by flatiron » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:37 PM UTC

Tepix wrote: post #116

saagarjha wrote: post #12

> On Android, there are tools that help prevent IT from reaching into your phone. If it’s allowed by your admin, you can create a separate “work” profile that contains sandboxed versions of your apps to avoid blurring the line between personal and work. The work profile can then be disabled on demand and flipped back on only when you need it, providing a level of control that iOS doesn’t yet allow. This is changing w…

Exactly. It's surprising that the article doesn't mention iOS 13 and user enrollment which hopefully solves the issue.

i would laugh if appleconnect/switchboard gets around that somehow.

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#164

Post by zippergz » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:38 PM UTC

lugg wrote: post #107

mti27 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly- if work doesn't pay, they don't get to play on my phone. I'd be willing to check work email sporadically, and it's unfortunate that doing so in any capacity means allowing an unknown admin "wipe my phone" privileges. Companies don't handle that stuff with any sort of finesse and mistakes happen. Ultimately email on a phone may be a moot point for software developers: We use more independent chat apps like Sl…

Slack, on my phone? Are you nuts? If you want me after hours you call. Thats the only option you have.

Are you, with a straight face, saying that you'd rather receive a PHONE CALL than a notification from an app that you can set time-sensitive notification methods for (i.e. DND overnight, etc.)? I'm not fan of getting any kind of work message outside of working hours, but I'd FAR rather let my co-workers send me a slack message that I can ignore and/or deal with when I feel like it than call me on the phone. No one at my office except my direct manager and HR has my phone number (and in the 5+ years I've worked here), no one has called me on it.

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#165

Post by bhandziuk » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:38 PM UTC

kemiller2002 wrote: post #102

Funny story (well OK, not so funny), I worked at a company where the FBI decided to pay a visit and investigate some potential naughtiness performed by members of the senior staff. They asked questions such as "Do you use your cell phone and personal email for company matters." Guess what a lot of them said, "Yep, have to." That immediately made their personal equipment, etc. in scope for the investigation and they c…

Is this only true for using some company provided app or even a dedicated email app? What about just going to webmail on a browser on a phone? Does that have the same implication?

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#166

Post by drcube » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:41 PM UTC

I've had a couple employers offer to transfer my personal number to my work-provided cell phone. I said no thanks, and carried two phones around instead. But it was a surprisingly popular option among my coworkers. They'd rather let their boss own their personal, everyday smartphone than carry around two phones.

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#167

Post by deftnerd » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:41 PM UTC

giobox wrote: post #155

Remember 10 years ago when people were predicting/building technology to let our phones run multiple "virtual" phone instances on a hypervisor, solving the work phone/play phone single device dilemma? I'd still freaking love this feature ten years later. I don't want app level segregation of work and play, I want them in entirely different "instances" of my phone. > https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2011…

I wish that there was some movement on that feature as well, but with time new possible implementations have become available on desktop environments that I would like see extended to mobile.

Application Streaming [1] is getting pretty solid, and I would love to see an integrated mobile solution for that.

It would be a good way to have the easy access to applications, but keep the code, manage the security, and keep the data on the server.

It wouldn't allow access to data when offline, but I think that's actually a benefit when it comes to security. It could also be used by corporations to quickly secure lost devices since there would be no cached data, as well as lock down access at certain places such as when crossing the US border or when employees are on vacation (in other countries, especially). [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_streaming

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#168

Post by mpeg » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:43 PM UTC

kemiller2002 wrote: post #102

Funny story (well OK, not so funny), I worked at a company where the FBI decided to pay a visit and investigate some potential naughtiness performed by members of the senior staff. They asked questions such as "Do you use your cell phone and personal email for company matters." Guess what a lot of them said, "Yep, have to." That immediately made their personal equipment, etc. in scope for the investigation and they c…

And that's why you don't talk to police; they could have just said no or refused to answer to make it harder for the investigators.

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#169

Post by neilv » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:44 PM UTC

Thinking ahead to the next time I need it (I haven't tested this), I was looking into current respectful options for people who are on-call in some way.

Considerations included not interrupting personal time or reminding people of work unnecessarily, location privacy, certainly not doing MDM of personal devices, security simplicity, etc.

The most interesting option was the old-school one-way radio alpha/numeric pager. It turns out that the Boston hospitals still use these heavily, as do some EMTs, and they're considered much more reliable than cellular- and WiFi-connected smartphones.

I'm imagining people on-call have their pager on, and it's only used for emergencies. There would be a couple/few numeric codes for the few different appropriate possibilities of importance/urgency/nature/modality, and what you should do. The most usual code might mean get on email/chat ASAP. Another code might mean phone devops ASAP. Code "666" apocalypse might mean call a car service immediately, get on phone/email/chat while you wait, don't delay to groom or anything.

As a matter of culture, all of the codes are worth bothering someone in their personal time. For example, maybe there's no code for "hey, if you have a second, it would save me half an hour if...". (Of course, we have to not raise the importance/urgency bar too much, or people might end up staying on chat or something, because the pager's bar is higher than their own.)

Re: Don’t Put Your Work Email on Your Personal Phone

#170

Post by Railsify » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 4:44 PM UTC

kemiller2002 wrote: post #102

Funny story (well OK, not so funny), I worked at a company where the FBI decided to pay a visit and investigate some potential naughtiness performed by members of the senior staff. They asked questions such as "Do you use your cell phone and personal email for company matters." Guess what a lot of them said, "Yep, have to." That immediately made their personal equipment, etc. in scope for the investigation and they c…

"...don't know who you are really working with..." this resonates with me, I recently left a company of finding out that the recently hired VP was the Presidents favorite bar tender, he was also trying to coax her into a relationship. The VP had also backdated her resume and was claiming to have been at the company about 4 years prior to her actual arrival.