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‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

independent.co.uk

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Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#71

Post by simonh »

vinceguidry wrote: post #57
simonh wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is it's not analysis. It's a completely unsubstantiated assertion of fact based on what's actually a wild guess. The info in the article isn't a study, it barely even summarises a study, and I'm willing to go out on a limb and say the commenter hasn't read the actual study. If so saying "this study isn't it" isn't simply an opinion, it's misrepresentation.

You're more than entitled to your opinion. You're not entitled to tell someone to shut up because of it.

I'm not telling anyone to shut up. i'm perfectly willing to read any reasoned counter-point to the article. I'm also completely willing to accept the information in the article, by itself, isn't clear evidence of anything.

However it quotes local officials who did do the study and have the detailed analysis saying there's a serious problem that warrants further investigation. They may be right or they may be wrong. Saying on the basis of what's here that the study is definitively bad or good isn't warranted though. That's all I'm saying.

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#72

Post by nerdponx »

iamshs wrote: post #67
weeksie wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire comment section is full of Indian bros reflexively inventing reasons why something like this is a put on in order to make India bad. Every comment section of any article that might put India in a bad light is. It's a particular brand of motivated reasoning, and I get it. But yeah India is not a great place for girls and women. That's changing bit by bit in the more advanced places but it's such a vast coun…

Comments are swarming with misdirection from Indians right now. Even if you cherry pick data, what even is probability of getting consecutive 216 heads on a coin toss? It is amazing that Indians here are acting as if female infanticide/foeticide is not a big menace in India.

You could probably work out on pen and paper how much foeticide would be necessary before these male birth numbers become probable.

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#73

Post by sametmax »

JohnBooty wrote: post #8

I can only imagine that there are a number of secondary effects of creating a skewed male/female ratio. Simply put, there are not enough women to go around. I suspect this leads to lots of overly fierce competition for women. Women treated more as precious commodities and less as human beings. Men lacking experience dealing with women. A certain percentage of men being unhappy much of the time because finding a mate…

This may results in many terrible problems:

- sexual frustration, which is already booming in India, could increase tenfold. Sexually frustrated males can lead to being apathetic or aggressive, none of which is good for society.

- more competition means bigger delta between the winners and the losers. And they already have a large money gap. Making this difference wider can only build more social tensions.

- not a biologist, but I imagine this affects the gene pool, and overall (including social) diversity as well. -

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#74

Post by simonh »

underwater wrote: post #55
maratumba wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haven't actually read the study but not sure I understand your comment. Even if every village has only one birth, the probability of having no girls at random is 1/(2 700) which seems practically impossible. Perhaps there is something else that made you response critically of their methods?

He was saying that 132 villages out of 700 villages had no female babies. > The 132 villages where no girls were born over three months have all been marked as part of a “red zone”, which means local data will be scrutinised more closely and health workers have been asked to be vigilant. The "red zone" is not a single area, it's a black list.

There's just not enough information in the article for any of us to know. If every village had one birth, you'd expect half of them to have had 'only girls'. It's hard to believe it's that simple a case though. Some of the villages may have had a dozen or more births, we just don't know.

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#75

Post by mruts »

wongarsu wrote: post #19
mruts wrote: post #3

Selective abortion is illegal? That’s pretty illiberal of them. Not that I’m surprised I suppose..

It's not ideologically inspired though, it's simple necessity. How Western liberals feel about it doesn't seem relevant here.

I mean you could say that about almost every repressive and abusive policy: censorship, secret police, mass executions, etc

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#76

Post by songeater »

nuwandavek wrote: post #5

Wow! I just released a data story on Indian population with a section on "Case of the missing women"[0]. This has profound effects on a society like India, even 2-3 decades later! [0] https://numbersofindia.github.io/stories/population-06-2019/...

beautiful work Vivek. one typo... your graphic on the food landscape says "MishItidoi" instead of "Mishtidoi"... the text heading is fine. Since this was so well done and clearly prepared with (heart)... didn't want that to stick out... especially to a bong like me :P

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#77

Post by teshier-A »

Shivetya wrote: post #30
codr7 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't see a problem with aborting because of the "wrong" gender? I don't know if you got the memo, but equal rights is a pretty Big Thing lately. I'm pretty sure most mothers would have preferred to keep all their children, and a society without women isn't going very far.

No. Before I get pummeled for that just be honest here. As soon as we state it is okay to abort for personal choice the discussion ends there. Why do we get to call in the woman's choice simply because we don't like the reason. It will get to be seriously interesting if DNA testing comes common place and women or couples decide to abort for reasons from sex, skin color, and if ever proven genetic orientation. You can…

"Until the 14th week of pregnancy, baby boys and girls look exactly the same on ultrasound" [0]

"Most countries in the European Union allow abortion on demand during the first trimester, with Sweden, the UK and the Netherlands having more extended time limits. After the first trimester (Ed : after 12 weeks), abortion is generally allowed only under certain circumstances, such as risk to woman's life or health, fetal defects or other specific situations that may be related to the circumstances of the conception or the woman's age." [1]

0 - https://www.livescience.com/45582-boy-or-girl.html

1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_law#Europe

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#78

Post by folbec »

seszett wrote: post #42
quaquaqua1 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

132 villages giving birth to only boys for 3 months straight is probably a 0.001% chance of happening naturally 1,000 births (a random guess) with 50% chance of girl, never happening once? yikes

> 1,000 births (a random guess) You don't have to guess, it's right there in the first sentence of the article. There have been 216 births, so about 1.6 per village, which makes having zero female birth statistically normal in each village individually, but possibly not over the whole area if these villages are all in the same area.

no girl in 216 birth is a probability of 1/(2^216) : it's either cherry picking or criminal. The article is ambiguous on the way the villages were identified ("a red zone" ???).

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#79

Post by rlpb »

weeksie wrote: post #58
simonh wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you read the study? Are you qualified to evaluate the statistical methodology and have you done such an analysis? If so fine, but otherwise neither you nor I are qualified to make a statement like that. There does seem to be something going on. According to Wikipedia only 43% of the population of the region are female. If 63 million women are statistically missing from the Indian population, I think it's pretty…

The entire comment section is full of Indian bros reflexively inventing reasons why something like this is a put on in order to make India bad. Every comment section of any article that might put India in a bad light is. It's a particular brand of motivated reasoning, and I get it. But yeah India is not a great place for girls and women. That's changing bit by bit in the more advanced places but it's such a vast coun…

I agree with your statement in general (including the distinction between backwards regions and more advanced places), but I do think that India is doing much better than other countries in the region in this regard. It's only notable because India tries, unlike other countries that don't.

Re: ‘No girls born’ for past three months in area of India covering 132 villages

#80

Post by Nasrudith »

ptah wrote: post #43

what has the consequences been historically speaking?

Generally internal instability from internal competition by discontent men, attempts to retain power by trying to "burn off" excess discontent fighting aged men with wars against some sort of external threat/scapegoat, or flat out exogamous raids to seize women - that has been an ancient dubious tradition since at least the bronze age.

How applicable it will be in the modern context is another story as ancients didn't have the degree of interconnectedness, offense/defense asymmetry of weapon superiority, or the "play nice or else" of Pax Atomica which has kept Pakistan and India shockingly civil even with terrorist attacks, border skirmishes, and similiar incidents.

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