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Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

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Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#241

Post by DonHopkins »

serf wrote: post #157
DonHopkins wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same Jordan B Peterson who asked "Is it possible that young women are so outraged because they are craving infant contact in a society that makes that very difficult?" -Jordan Peterson, infant craver Who denies women have been systematically oppressed: "The idea that women were oppressed throughout history is an appalling theory." -Jordan Peterson, history understander Who claims to be a champion free speech, yet…

>The same Jordan B Peterson who asked ... sure. I'm no big fan, but don't color good advice bad when it comes from the wrong person. All his quote is advocating for is self-reference and relativity with regards to self improvement. It's sort of like quoting Mark Twain. 4/5 people will enjoy the quote, that last person will bring up what a tyrannical bigoted racist he was. (opinion theirs) The reality is that people w…

I didn't reject his advice -- just the opposite: I endorsed it. Notice that in my reply to the question "Is that quote bad advice?", I gave him due credit for his "excellent advice", and helpfully suggested he follow it himself.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20437177

I'm not even suggesting you "live your whole life without listening to" him -- just the opposite: I actually quoted his own words, and linked to more quotes and information about him, in case some people hadn't already heard them.

And no, I don't envy him, nor do I want to be like him, nor do I even want to physically assault him by slapping him, like he wants to slap Pankaj Mishra.

Maybe we should all take his other sagely timeless advice and "toughen up", and not be as thin skinned and prone to unraveling and throwing tantrums as he is, or threatening lawsuits and physical violence in response to legitimate criticism, huh?

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#242

Post by elindbe2 »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #233
blub wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Life doesn't have a point though, today maybe not even reproduction. We search for meaning ourselves and find it in different things.

Hence why I said you have to do what makes meaning for you.

But you seem to be suggesting that something has to come in the form of paid employment. There's plenty of stuff I find meaning in, people just don't tend to be willing to pay me for it.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#243

Post by elindbe2 »

colordrops wrote: post #100
brankoB wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that quote makes much sense. I can want a specific thing someone has (e.g. praise for work done) without wanting /everything/ they have.

I think his point is that typically the context of all the particular aspects of that person's life feed into the reason why they have that one thing you want.

Not necessarily. The fact that I brush my teeth in a certain way doesn't determine the kind of car I drive or whether I love my wife.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#244

Post by unnouinceput »

dazilcher wrote: post #191
unnouinceput wrote: post #171

Usually I am the object of envy from others (family, friends, acquaintance, neighbors). As a freelancer whom can afford to spend a lot of time doing fun stuff and travel with my family, they always ask me how much money I make. I just explain I am a freelancer and I do stuff on internet, but I never disclose my real income. One time I met an old friend whom I lost touch, we were in the beginning of 2000's simple prog…

So you avoid disclosing your income, but then ask your old colleague point-blank for his. Care to elaborate on this apparent inconsistency? Have you considered his jaw dropping has little to do with your made up figures, and more with your general attitude?

jealous much?

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#245

Post by unnouinceput »

ccou wrote: post #174
unnouinceput wrote: post #171

Usually I am the object of envy from others (family, friends, acquaintance, neighbors). As a freelancer whom can afford to spend a lot of time doing fun stuff and travel with my family, they always ask me how much money I make. I just explain I am a freelancer and I do stuff on internet, but I never disclose my real income. One time I met an old friend whom I lost touch, we were in the beginning of 2000's simple prog…

I'm sorry but I fail to understand how this post was in any way helpful. Can you explain what it was here that you thought would help OP in helping him deal with his problems?

By providing him with an advice on dealing with the opposite side of the coin. Unless you're unable to comprehend how this world work, everybody's gonna figure it out sooner or later in life how to be successful. So the OP will be at one time in the future object of envy as well.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#246

Post by chrshawkes »

Viliam1234 wrote: post #63
rb808 wrote: post #10

I have a variety of ways to analyse this: 0) Remember that social media and the press shows the best parts of people's lives and rarely the crappy parts that everyone has. 1) You can't have it all. Often people sacrifice other parts of their lives to achieve in one area. My old boss that got promoted to a very high position never found a partner or children. Other tech friends who have earned a lot have worked thier…

> 0) Remember that social media and the press shows the best parts of people's lives and rarely the crappy parts that everyone has. When I take a picture on camera, I sometimes realize that a person looking at the picture will probably imagine something much better than reality. For example, an entire day spent with my kids who try to be as annoying as possible; then for five minutes they act cute, and I make a nice…

"When I take a picture on camera, I sometimes realize that a person looking at the picture will probably imagine something much better than reality."

I'm a parent and I think you raise a good point but I think most parents see right through that. :)

Most photos and even YouTube videos are completely fake and doctored. The filters amplify this even more. Although my pics with my children were not filled with happiness the entire time, they are the happiest and proudest moments of my life (some of them, not all).

I've played the entrepreneurial game for a long time. I found success and won awards along the way. The time spent with my children is more important than all of that. It's a fine balance though. Nobody wants to be a loser, so we're forced to work harder than the next guy/girl.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#248

Post by [deleted] »

PopeDotNinja wrote: post #52
o-__-o wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In other words, volunteering and helping the needy brings happiness to everyone involved and sets up paths to success for all. Keep some old shoes or take your restaurant leftovers with you to give to that next homeless guy at the intersection

If you like to be extra generous, buy them a new pair of shoes or a meal of their choosing.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#249

Post by AndrewKemendo »

JohnBooty wrote: post #235
ludston wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Failure is such a normal thing that I cannot see how it would be heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking to think that some see all failure as a dark thing that must be avoided. Holding failure in low esteem is a path of fear and egomania. It sure is possible to rebrand every failure we make as success in some thing else. "I failed to win the tennis match, but I succeeded in hitting the ball into the net!". There is a reas…

There is a reason "fail fast" is a mantra: it's through looking at our errors we have chances to do better. I'd agree, though that's not what this discussion was originally about. It sure is possible to rebrand every failure we make as success in some thing else. "I failed to win the tennis match, but I succeeded in hitting the ball into the net!". I agree, though nobody (at least not in this discussion) is endorsing…

To be clearer "Cognitive Dissonance" is the feeling, it's not an activity that someone engages in. So the OP has the feeling of cognitive dissonance between their "21 year old self" and where they are today.

My statement was meant to say that a common way people cope with this, in my experience, is to convince themselves to satisfice [1] instead of continuing to pursue their original goal.

It could be claimed that for certain things, this could be considered "growing up" or "maturing", which in many cases might be true. The child who gives up their dream to be a superhero is truly maturing because superhero was never really an option.

However falling into a stable local minima because you didn't become the CEO of a F500 company or become a championship tennis player etc...and convincing yourself that being a regional VP or a high school tennis coach is just as good because [reasons] seems to be how people cope with this dissonance.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satisficing

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional envy?

#250

Post by totaldude87 »

CalRobert wrote: post #81

At the end of the day, it's just a fucking job. If you need the money I understand the envy, and I've been there. But ultimately most of us are working really hard to make other people rich. Being really good at that game (and it's a pretty bitter game) isn't something to be envious of. I have never seen a high paying job in tech that wasn't ALSO higher stress and generally more hours. I'm sure exceptions exist, but…

>> There's always someone faster, slower, richer, poorer, healthier, and sicker than you.

THIS! made my day!

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