Live data from Hacker News

Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

arstechnica.com

151–160 of 249 posts

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#151
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In many scenarios, simply having the company not sue you if you did get your hands on a CPU replacent is an improvemt.

Except if the company doesn’t sell those cpus separately, in which case you know you’re buying stolen goods.

So if I take a CPU and remove it from the motherboard than resell it separately it would be stolen if the CPU was only sold bundled with a board by the manufacturer?

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#152

I recently discovered Louis Rossman's Youtube channel and it planted a virus in my head to make me want to try much harder to repair things. Recently my water bottle leaked on my $2000 Thinkpad and fried the LAN card. Ubuntu started complaining that it couldn't find the Wireless adapter to find wifi networks. I think a couple years ago, I'd have just thrown in the towel right away and bought a new computer. Instead I…

For non-electronics, I bought a huge umbrella online once. It was missing a thin metal rod that helped form a hinge in the umbrella. I told the company this, they sent me a new one and told me to throw the old one away.

Because throwing it away would be ridiculously wasteful, instead I went to Home Depot, bought a steel rod of appropriate diameter for $3, cut off a piece and used that.

So I got 2 umbrellas for the price of one.

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#153
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People can still find the business by searching " repair shop" as well as possibly "repair ship " but the issue is not being able to advertise on terms like "fix iphone 8" or "ifixit iphone".

Not to be that guy, but why do you feel you are entitled to advertise on somebody else's trademark?

It's obviously an instance of fair use. Otherwise no indy auto repair shops could advertise, for example.

Where the problems come in is when the actual name of the business includes a third party trademark. Try calling your business "Joe's Cut-Rate Porsche Service" and you can expect a C&D order.

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#154
post #68

> John Deere argues that access to the company’s proprietary software could be used to bypass emissions controls or safety measures. On an analog car, I can physically remove emissions control devices. I can short circuit the seat belt warning. I can pull a fuse and disable the (not quite analog) antilock brakes. I can fail to change the tires when they have an unsafe amount of tread. I'm less familiar with farm equi…

It’s coming for cars too.

Preventing repair? It's possible, although it's worth noting that auto makers used to do more to prevent repair, but were forced to back down by a 2012 Massachusetts automotive right-to-repair law.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/02/automobiles/carmakers-to-...

via https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/06/opinion/sunday/right-to-r...

via OP

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#155
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People can still find the business by searching " repair shop" as well as possibly "repair ship " but the issue is not being able to advertise on terms like "fix iphone 8" or "ifixit iphone".

Not to be that guy, but why do you feel you are entitled to advertise on somebody else's trademark?

He's not advertising "on sombedoy else's trademark". He's advertising a business that offer third party repair services of a product name . You are commenting on an article titled "Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows", so perhaps his feeling of "entitlement" is the topic of the article?

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#156
For those who are having trouble finding reasons why farmers care about right to repair, its not just the tractors themselves but the PTO accessories in most cases.

For example, many PTO links on newer John Deer or Ferguson tractors contain a set of over torque sensors designed to shut off ot disconnect to prevent stallout and engine damage. if you repaired a spreader or a mower assembly from a John Deere, it needs to have all the original sensors on it to operate from the cab, and those sensors need to all return normal "john deere" values/codes for the implement. if not, you need to pay John Deere for another farm implement.

Farmers want the right to upgrade the firmware in-cab or make exceptions to allow repaired equipment.

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it causes massive unsustainable externalities when that business model is applied by many firms across the economy as a whole? The only reason that manufacturers can get away with planned obsolescence is because they don't have to pay any disposal fees to recycle/remanufacture their equipment. If they took a hit to their bottom line every time a consumer threw out their product, I'm willing to be they'd desig…

... how much do you think device disposal actually costs?

ex·ter·nal·i·ty

noun

a side effect or consequence of an industrial or commercial activity that affects other parties without this being reflected in the cost of the goods or services involved

(emphasis added)

https://www.google.com/search?q=define+externality

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#158

I recently discovered Louis Rossman's Youtube channel and it planted a virus in my head to make me want to try much harder to repair things. Recently my water bottle leaked on my $2000 Thinkpad and fried the LAN card. Ubuntu started complaining that it couldn't find the Wireless adapter to find wifi networks. I think a couple years ago, I'd have just thrown in the towel right away and bought a new computer. Instead I…

Usually things like coffee grinders or electric stand mixers that have a motor and a gearbox include a plastic piece that is intended to fail first precisely so they are easily and cheaply repaired. They honestly should advertise it on the box, but that'd cut into their repair business.

In some cases, this is attributed to bad design or bad materials choice; and maybe in some cases, it's done to make you purchase a new model.

But in many cases, such breakable parts are put in place for a reason. They are called "mechanical fuses" - also known by a few other names:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacrificial_part

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shear_pin

They are designed to break if the machine comes under too much stress that could break more expensive parts of the machine if the "fuse" wasn't included. Instead, that part breaks, making it cheap and easy to replace.

Indeed, if you ever find a Kitchen Aid stand mixer in the trash, it likely got there because a gear in the gearbox is designed for this reason; they are cheap and easy to replace for anyone with a modest amount of mechanical ability, and those mixers aren't inexpensive new.

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#159
post #25

Here's another way Apple may be killing "right to repair": I own a chain of independent cell phone and computer repair shops. Last year, Google unilaterally took away AdWords in our industry. The day after Thanksgiving, we woke up to find none of our ads were running. Google claimed this was because "third-party tech support providers" were scamming customers--i.e. people were buying AdWords for virus removal and tec…

Welp, there it is. As clear cut a case of the dangers of Google basically holding the keys to the internet for the masses as I've ever seen. How's the ads on Facebook and Instagram doing?

Objectively, Facebook ads have recently gotten _a lot_ worse because they removed most of the targeting abilities. Targeting was always the competitive edge FB had.

(Whether this an overall good or bad thing I leave as an exercise to the reader.)

Re: Support for right-to-repair laws slowly grows

#160
post #10
post #2

You should have this basic right to repair. If you are unable to repair it and even break it further, it will cost you more for the company to repair it. This right should have the right to have the repair company to connect it and scan it, for a nominal fee, and tell you what is broken and what they would charge. You can then decide. With the complexity of modern devices, you may have to go to another company with s…

Forcing a company to have a diagnostic tool or team to identify a problem you might not have them fix is silly IMO. So is forcing their hand on creating a repairable product. I don't expect Microsoft to be able to easily identify obscure hardware issues with a design like my Surface Book 2. I do expect them to create a hardware product that doesn't break easily. Supplying the specs is a big benefit in my purchase dec…

forcing their hand on creating a repairable product.

I don't believe any of the proposals mentioned by the OP nor the comment you're replying to are suggesting this.

Supplying the specs is a big benefit in my purchase decision. But not something I think should be required since it will undoubtedly give competitors more of an edge in their own development.

Competition is what I value about markets. Preventing anti-competitive behavior is a big thing I value about regulation. These seem like reasons for, not against, right-to-repair.

Post reply on HN