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The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

citylab.com

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Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#121

Post by stcredzero »

duxup wrote: post #45
bluGill wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it isn't obvious the question shouldn't be asked. Just put in a Bus rapid transit system, and change the line every few months until you find a "line" that is profitable, then keep that line going for a few years to prove it works long term. Now you have real rider numbers to plug into the equation of if the line is worth it.

I'm not sure rider number experiments are really needed. At least in MN rider predictions were on the conservative side, but reasonable as far as predictors. Granted that doesn't mean your idea is bad or anything. I do wonder how many people would change their routine for a "temporary" bus line... not sure they would.

I think it was Portland (it was somewhere in the Pacific NW) in the 90's had a "custom bus" running late at night. If you lived within 2 miles of a regular bus route, you could phone in a request, and a dispatcher would make up a new bus line for that night that would pick up everyone who called in.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#122

Post by NeedMoreTea »

Retric wrote: post #81
jcranmer wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not necessarily. The key cost savings that Musk envisions boils down to "build tunnels that are too small to put existing rolling stock in," which means that if the proposed personal rapid transit system turns out to be like every other PRT system and not work well, you're left with a tunnel that is too small to be useful for anything else.

Making an existing tunnel wider is vastly cheaper than building an equivalent tunnel from scratch. Simply knowing the soil composition makes a huge difference. In hard rock you can use drilling and blasting across long sections rather than just the leading edge. Alternatively, a TBM needs to remove significantly less material.

Almost every tunnel has a lining that makes widening prohibitive. Which is why the London Underground is forever stuck with small tunnels on the original lines.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#123

Post by 3JPLW »

BorgHunter wrote: post #118
3JPLW wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, we just set our tracks on fire. It's fine. (Well, that's the ground-level light rail — Metra — that does that)

This is the first time I've ever heard of Metra referred to as "light rail". Metra uses enormous diesel locomotives and runs on freight rail ROW (for the most part)--there's nothing "light" about it.

Yeah, should have said "commuter rail" instead of light rail. For some reason I have those terms jumbled in my head.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#124

Post by _Microft »

spraak wrote: post #95
calgoo wrote: post #67

I love watching all of Musk's projects, as every single one can be connected to Mars colonization. 1. Electric cars for transport, Check. 2. Solar panels and batteries for power generation and storage, check. 3. Tunnel digging equipment for making underground bases and transport, check. 4. Satellite communications for an entire planet, check. 5. Then finally, the actual rockets to get us there. Hopefully he will cont…

The goal of Mars to me is silly. Mars is already worse off in terms of climate than Earth. Why not work to improve what we have? The only appeal I see is "uncharted territory" / wild west

It's not a replacement, it's a backup. You don't do these after a headcrash either but start doing them as soon as possible.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#125

Post by _ph_ »

Robotbeat wrote: post #85
fabioborellini wrote: post #27

Maybe Elon should visit Europe or Asia and check out an underground mass rapid transit system or two. They have two orders of magnitude larger capacity. And even their capacity is finite. And keep in mind that the NYC Subway and the London Underground are NOT a good example of a modern mass transit system.

I've noticed that Elon Musk's projects often start off in the wrong direction, but evolve in a way that works ultimately. And that's what matters. For instance, SpaceX originally insisted on parachute recovery of their Falcon 1 and Falcon 9 rockets. They tried, and it didn't work. But they switched to powered landing as some others had demonstrated (DC-X and Masten Space Systems and Armadillo Aerospace), and they mas…

And he is iterating a lot. His designs usually are not finished, when they get used for the first time. The first F9 wasn't reusable and had much less power than the current block 5. But it was flying, good enough to sustain business and giving opportunity to learn and experiment. All the crashes while getting the landing right were of no consequence for the launching business. All the tests happened with rockets which had delivered their cargo.

I see a similar development with the Boring company. They have dug their first demonstration tunnel. So they have a basic handle on tunnel digging. Doing so they made valuable experiences and claim to have improved their digging machine already significantly. Digging the Las Vegas tunnel is going to add much more experience to it and means, the company is a working business. They might not have a good idea yet, what to drive through the tunnel, but I am sure, they will come up with something. At the first presentation, they drove a Model X with guiding wheels attached at like 40mph. That was nice, but not great. Now they made a new video - they have redone the tunnel floor and now a Tesla reaches 127 mph just driving on autopilot through the tunnel. If everything else is worked out, I am sure there will be a custom vehicle driving through these tunnels, which optimizes throughput.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#126

Post by dredmorbius »

rayiner wrote: post #6

So what’s this fascination with tunnels? In Chicago, there are overhead elevated train tracks, and they work just fine. They seem a lot cheaper to build and maintain than tunnels. You can even build them over existing avenues. Why don’t we have more of that?

"How often does the train go by?"

"So often you won't even notice."

https://youtube.com/watch?v=JRRksyGCjoE

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#127

Post by spookware »

spraak wrote: post #95
calgoo wrote: post #67

I love watching all of Musk's projects, as every single one can be connected to Mars colonization. 1. Electric cars for transport, Check. 2. Solar panels and batteries for power generation and storage, check. 3. Tunnel digging equipment for making underground bases and transport, check. 4. Satellite communications for an entire planet, check. 5. Then finally, the actual rockets to get us there. Hopefully he will cont…

The goal of Mars to me is silly. Mars is already worse off in terms of climate than Earth. Why not work to improve what we have? The only appeal I see is "uncharted territory" / wild west

For me its to get away from religion.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#129

Post by tntn »

ryantgtg wrote: post #56
michaelleslie wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like a less-scalable metro system, a technology that predates this "innovation" by a century or so.

Yeah, the joke is that next they'll release that the concrete tunnel road is subject to deterioration, so they'll shift to steel tracks. Then they'll realize that these individual vehicles should be linked together to allow for higher capacity. Then... then you have a subway.

That would be great. Subway costs are absolutely ridiculous, so it would be fantastic if the boring company decides to build exactly the same thing for much less.

Re: The Boring Company will develop an underground “people mover” for Las Vegas

#130

Post by nsxwolf »

ryantgtg wrote: post #56
michaelleslie wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like a less-scalable metro system, a technology that predates this "innovation" by a century or so.

Yeah, the joke is that next they'll release that the concrete tunnel road is subject to deterioration, so they'll shift to steel tracks. Then they'll realize that these individual vehicles should be linked together to allow for higher capacity. Then... then you have a subway.

A subway where you can snap a segment off a train and take it out on the highway sounds awesome.
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