201–210 of 526 posts
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You mean the servers Apple has running on WebObjects, JEE and Clojure for iTunes, Apple Maps and their iCloud?
Microsoft is currently the most valuable company in the world.
Oracle never fails to show off how evil they are.
Oracle actually is what techies used to think Microsoft was. Fortunately for all of us, they never managed to escape their niche.
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And all of them have a lot of work to catch up with 25 years of market experience.
Because development that happened in 1994 is really relevant today. How will these languages ever catch up with innovations like JavaBeans, Java Server Pages, and Java Server Faces?
Types. Clumsy stand-ins for synchronous behavior like async/await. Transaction managers. Threads. I'd add immutability and functional programming but really that's rediscovering technology from the midcentury.
We really are doomed to repeat history.
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Strange attitude to take when you can just target OpenJDK and then it is completely irrelevant what Oracle does or does not do. The fact is that every single one of the largest companies has some Java or Scala code within their core platform. And none of them have ever raised Oracle as a risk.
The most valuable corporation in the world as of this date uses zero Java for anything “core”. Anecdotally, nearly every CIO/CTO I’ve encountered in the last few sees Oracle as a huge risk. Most particularly with regards to databases, which are even sticker than applications which have shorter life cycles.
MS did have a Java clone 20 years ago, but gave up due to legal threat from Sun and the DOJ lawsuit.
Ironically, MS has quite a few of Android apps [0]. Has been for several years. I guess there is at least some Java there. Unless you don't consider Office "core".
[0] https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/mobileapps?activetab=pivot_1...
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Because development that happened in 1994 is really relevant today. How will these languages ever catch up with innovations like JavaBeans, Java Server Pages, and Java Server Faces?
Considering that we're watching the javascript ecosystem slowly fumble its way through reinventing the technologies of the past, I'd say 1994 is pretty damn relevant. Types. Clumsy stand-ins for synchronous behavior like async/await. Transaction managers. Threads. I'd add immutability and functional programming but really that's rediscovering technology from the midcentury. We really are doomed to repeat history.
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Time to switch to C#. Funny how it took Oracle to do what C# originally intended to do: kill Java.
hand up uh not as experienced as most people on HN, what's the hate for c#? I went from vb6 to VB.net then c# and while I fully admit I'm a casual coder, i haven't had an issue (with what I do, which is voice to string primarily) so far. Is there something better for this I perhaps should look into?
I only write C# despite having tried a few other languages (F#, Python, Java, Elixir, etc) because I'm not prepared to invest the time in languages until the tooling is as productive for me as C#. I'm more interested in what I want to do than how to write it. Both C# and Java remain big in the market here in the UK and I believe in the US; you just might not find work at the cutting edge with them.
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Working in the JVM world I'm always surprised to hear that its dying, the JVM and Java moves faster forward than ever, Graal is about to go 1.0, a bunch of very interesting (very) low latency GCs are in the pipe (for example ZGC and Shenandoah) and lots of other interesting projects like Valhalla promise to keep the JVM relevant for the next 20 years. Oracle have made some moves to monetize on parts of its investment…
Java the language is slightly different than JVM but nevertheless the future is not very bright IMO. So far there are a few areas Java/JVM still holds a strong position but if you take a look at GitHub trending there is little or now new blood coming in. - Android. No serious competitor to Java yet (JVM is irrelevant). But the Google lawsuit could have some complication. - Spring stuff. I won't be surprised if they w…
Was hoping that Kotlin+Spring could be a good alternative to GoLang for realtime apps, but haven't tried it yet.
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You can't be serious. JVM is still the best platform for any type of back-end application. It has the widest array of libraries, is proven to run on any type of hardware and comes standard on every OS and every cloud instance. .Net is a great platform and all but it still hasn't done enough to really merit switching teams. Especially when you have Scala, Kotlin, Clojure etc to pick from.
Java doesn’t come standard on Windows, MacOS, or iOS. It’s also not standard on Windows based EC2 instances. But even if it does come “standard” on Linux. How many people actually count on the installed instances of runtimes and don’t install their own tested versions? For instance, Python 2.7 comes on a Windows EC2 AWS instance.
Dumb question... Wouldn't it be possible to fork the namespace to something like javax -> jawax (or java->borneo as someone suggested) and then patch the JVM to alias the javax package to the would-be jawax package (or borneox or whatever) ?
Eclipse will almost surely fork the namespace to something jakarta related.
The Java ecosystem has been slowly dying for years, it's already the new Cobol at this stage. I have the impression that a lot of the mindshare has switched to the Node and Javascript ecosystem, especially the frontend devs, via the Typescript / Angular path, which is a natural path to Java developers due to the comfort given by familiar concepts like static types, classes, etc. When I used to do Java, I always found…
Java has been the new COBOL since its inception in the 1990s.
I programmed quite a bit in COBOL early in my career. It's an extremely efficient language for scanning records especially in an era when a large proportion of data was stored offline on mag tape. Most common business problems of the era could be expressed and solved effectively in COBOL, which is why it became so popular.
I programmed in both C++ and Smalltalk in the early 1990s, which were innovative but also difficult to use for large systems. Java hit a happy medium with its C++-like object syntax, built-in libraries, and virtual machine operation with garbage collection. Add in the network effects from wide adoption (leading to tools and libraries) and it became a huge hit.
Oracle seems to be going out of its way to submerge the language in confusion. But nobody should mistake this as a reflection on the inherent capabilities of Java or its fitness for use.
Edit: correct typo