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No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

reuters.com

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Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#31

Post by beart »

duado wrote: post #22
cladari wrote: post #21

Licensed nuclear plant control room operators go through 40 hours of training every 6 week. Generally 5 weeks of operations rotation then 1 week of training, all year, every year. Twenty hours of classroom and 20 hours of simulator training, the week includs a written and simulator exam. Failing either and the operator is taken off shift until his remediation training is complete and exams passed. If pilots rotated i…

A nuclear power plant failure, in the worst case, is much worse than the worst case pilot error.

Not if the plane lands on a nuclear power plant

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#32

Post by tyingq »

RandomBacon wrote: post #15
xmichael999 wrote: post #2

you won't be seeing me on one of them until it gets a new type rating

I imagine it would still be more dangerous to drive to the airport than it would be to fly on a 737 Max.

I wonder how much of the apprehension is because dying in an airplane is more likely to come with a longer period of being terrified before impact. I suppose, for some reason, not offset by a higher likelihood of suffering after impact in a car.

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#34

Post by dreamcompiler »

RandomBacon wrote: post #15
xmichael999 wrote: post #2

you won't be seeing me on one of them until it gets a new type rating

I imagine it would still be more dangerous to drive to the airport than it would be to fly on a 737 Max.

True, but because the FAA has (historically) done an excellent job on airline safety, people expect zero risk from air travel. Everybody knows cars are dangerous (at least in principle, even if they think they personally will never be in a crash).

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#35

Post by achandlerwhite »

Declanomous wrote: post #28
WrtCdEvrydy wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> he shows a simulated runaway MCAS failure 'I am not doing that...' is now on my most terrifying phrases to hear.

The thing that was the most chilling to me was the fact that the last item on the memory checklist is to try and prevent the trim wheel from moving using physical force. At that point it almost seems like "well, you are probably going to die, but you might as well keep yourself busy in the process." I thought the communication was really interesting. Air France Flight 447[1] crashed due to the pilot flying pulling ba…

I can’t watch the video at the moment, but I’m of the understanding that the manual wheel actually easily overpowers the electric trim motors—-that it is simple to stop them from spinning and not to difficult to manually spin them as required.

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#36

Post by achandlerwhite »

m3kw9 wrote: post #4

They really should limit the amount of special circumstances a pilot needs to train for. Each new one adds to a risk esp one like this

Isn’t that what they were trying to do? Reasoning that the MCAS failure mode was runaway trim and the fact that pilots are trained for runaway trim? (Obviously in reality this reasoning is flawed)

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#37

Post by goolagEmployee »

Boeing fails to take into account that the IQ of a typical third world pilot is lower than IQ of a Chinese or a white American pilot. Thus the systems and training that in the past would have been OK for a US airline need to be dumbed down for an African or an South East Asian pilot. This is a new reality given the Boeing's market shift.

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#38

Post by goolag1 »

Boeing fails to take into account that the IQ of a typical third world pilot is lower than IQ of a Chinese or a white American pilot. Thus the systems and training that in the past would have been OK for a US airline need to be dumbed down for an African or an South East Asian pilot. This is a new reality given the Boeing's market shift.

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#39

Post by blhack »

emilsedgh wrote: post #24
volkl48 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US airlines all purchased some/all of the "optional" safety features that would have made it obvious to the pilots that the system was malfunctioning.

There is no regulation that prevents them from making safety-related components optional?

Nearly every option you could add to an airplane is arguably a safety feature.

Re: No call for simulators in new Boeing 737 Max training proposals

#40

Post by krustchinsky »

gotocake wrote: post #12
ReptileMan wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing mind boggling. Boeing are trying desperately to avoid new type rating. That would leave them in the same business position where they were before developing MAX and with a bad image to boot. Not saying they are right, but they just don't have many good moves. Doing the Right thing leaves them years behind. It will also limit airline expansion. Airbus cannot pick up slack and there are no other players in the…

Except it has failed, twice. It’s not as though shoving it back out the door and crossing fingers isn’t potentially going to lead to more tragedy and an even worse image, plus the potential for ruinous lawsuits. Boeing is in a terrible position they created and the only way out will hurt them, but less than staying the course.

Once. Do you have a copy of the running report for the Ethiopian crash? We don't know yet.
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