Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

wired.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 362 posts

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#111

Post by praneshp »

duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

> , we had a limit on how many units could rent out at once anyway so they never were going to have enough numbers

What does this mean? If I owned a house in your neighborhood and had to move away for work, my options are to sell the house, or get on a waitlist till the number of houses rented out reduces?

As someone that's never owned a house, that sounds like a shitty rule that should be disrupted. I'm assuming there is a positive side to that only homeowners can see.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#112

Post by jak92 »

joseph-curwen wrote: post #99
jak92 wrote: post #4

Just look at the havoc being reigned on some neighborhoods in Miami Beach during spring break. Specifically the low-scale, residential flamingo park neighborhood of south beach.

Here is a story about Miami Beach: I moved there 9 years ago and have spent the last 8 years living on Ocean Drive in South Beach. When I first moved there the neighborhood was full of high-class tourists, a lot of Europeans. The beach was not extremely crowded, you had nice restaurants and upscale shops and the vibes you were getting were similar to what you would see in the Mediterranean (Spain / south France). Wit…

> Here is a story about Miami Beach:

> I moved there 9 years ago and have spent the last 8 years > living on Ocean Drive in South Beach.

Hello neighbor! Interesting connection - I never linked the two together but it's certainly possible.

The story of Miami Beach the last 5 years is so true and so sad.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#113

Post by dcosson »

duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

I mean, this just sounds to me like a pitch for AirBnB. They managed to solve this exact problem you're complaining about via the rating system and guests being attached to their real identity. The vast majority of AirBnB guests are very respectful and reasonable.

As for your tight local control, fuck that. No, you shouldn't get to decide exactly what happens in your neighborhood just because you got there first. You don't own the neighborhood, you own single plot of land, and people who want to buy other plots of land and collectively evolve the neighborhood in new directions should have just as much of a right as you do.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#114

Post by jak92 »

jseliger wrote: post #63
jak92 wrote: post #4

Just look at the havoc being reigned on some neighborhoods in Miami Beach during spring break. Specifically the low-scale, residential flamingo park neighborhood of south beach.

I would say that one should look at the hovoc that reigns in neighborhoods with draconian zoning that prevents sufficient supply from coming online to meet demand for housing and hotels. We have the technologies necessary to build housing demanded by humans; we just make deploying that tech illegal.

There are hundreds of hotel units under construction in Miami Beach right now. I would certainly say that it's not a supply problem.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#115

Post by braythwayt »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #80
braythwayt wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should zoning laws be fought tooth-and-nail? If I buy a house in a neighbourhood full of single-family dwellings that are all one and two storeys high, should I be able to build a condo building on my land? Can I open a nightclub in my house? What about parking? Can I pave my front lawn and rent the space out as parking spots? Or maybe put a dumpster there for local businesses to put their trash in? There's a tre…

>Why should zoning laws be fought tooth-and-nail? Because infringing on people's right to do what they want with their property deserves a hell of a lot more scrutiny than it gets right now. Trying to centrally manage what can be done where doesn't scale. See SF housing prices. >Can I open a nightclub in my house? As long as it meets the standards that night clubs have to meet then sure. You're unlikely to be able to…

There's nothing stopping you from buying a piece of land and having no zoning controls. Then you can market it as a neighbourhood for people who want to be free.

Good luck finding anyone to live in that kind of neighbourhood by choice. If you have an area with zero controls, it quickly will become a race-to-the-bottom.

The kinds of people who want to live in a nice neighbourhood, and be nice neighbours, will go live somewhere else.

It turns out that people feel the same way about freedom to do what you like with your single-family home as they do about the freedom to drive a car without getting a license or being insured, and the freedom to drive on whichever side of the road you like, and the freedom to drive a vehicle without smog regulation or safety rules.

Most people don't want your freedom, because the upside of their freedom is greatly outweighed by the downsides of their neighbour's freedoms.

They'll all just go any set up gated communities where everyone buying a home must contractually agree to the neighbourhood's own regulations.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#116

Post by TheHypnotist »

matchbok wrote: post #91
TheHypnotist wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a few mini-hotels - properties with more than one room. How many are corporate owned is undetermined. This guy is just bitter about something, perhaps rightfully so. Or maybe just vote manipulation.

Incorrect. Most of AirBnBs profit comes from units that do not have the owner present. Aka a hotel.

Not only is that not the definition of hotel, you seem to think this carries a negative connotation?

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#117

Post by braythwayt »

stale2002 wrote: post #85
braythwayt wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should zoning laws be fought tooth-and-nail? If I buy a house in a neighbourhood full of single-family dwellings that are all one and two storeys high, should I be able to build a condo building on my land? Can I open a nightclub in my house? What about parking? Can I pave my front lawn and rent the space out as parking spots? Or maybe put a dumpster there for local businesses to put their trash in? There's a tre…

> Why should zoning laws be fought tooth-and-nail Because it is mostly used by rich property owners to artificial prop up the value of their capital investment, to the detriment of renters and people who cannot afford to purchase properties.

I'm 100% up for making long-term rental more available. I am not in any way supportive of the SF model.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#118

Post by TheHypnotist »

prklmn wrote: post #64
TheHypnotist wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is this disgusting? Down vote with no answer?

Suing every city trying to regulate your service that’s harming city residents is just lovely to you?

That's not what he said.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#119

Post by CharlesColeman »

koboll wrote: post #55
duxup wrote: post #26

I lived a few doors down to someone who basically ran an ad hoc AirBnB ... before Airbnb. It was pretty terrible. Parties all the time, trash, they parked anywhere (in other people's driveways...) because there were likely no long term consequences for doing so, the folks staying there didn't care because why should they? I was on the association board, it's kinda thankless job as we had to deal with this house. We g…

>In the end it was just a horrible situation to open up what was a hotel, right in the middle of our association / neighborhood. By joining a HOA, you've delegated away to the collective the right to dictate to your neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property. In your case, the system worked - because you are in a HOA. If people want to exert that kind of collectivist control over their neighbors, th…

>> By joining a HOA, you've delegated away to the collective the right to dictate to your neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property....

> But outside of that structure, what gives someone the right to dictate to their neighbors what they can and can't do with their own property?

The fact that you live in close proximity to them so many of your activities can affect them, and that it's only by communal agreement that you even have "property" at all.

Re: Airbnb’s ‘Guerrilla War’ Against Local Governments

#120

Post by jseliger »

flexie wrote: post #79
matchbok wrote: post #15

AirBnb is a terrible, terrible company. Most of their money comes from corporate-owned mini-hotels yet they advertise as a mom and pop shop. At every turn their solution is to sue small towns and cities so they can continue to extract wealth from our neighborhoods. Disgusting.

There are not many "corporate-owned mini-hotels" but there are certainly hundreds of thousands of people that buy one or more apartments with the purpose of renting them out through AirBnB (or not sell apartments that they would otherwise have gotten rid off). AirBnB doesn't make the little guy make a few extra bucks renting out a room as much as it makes those who already have money buy up studios and one bedroom ap…

AirBnB doesn't make the little guy make a few extra bucks renting out a room as much as it makes those who already have money buy up studios and one bedroom apartments. The effect is that such apartments get more expensive for those who just need a place to live.

If only there were some way of increasing the number of housing units on a given area of land, this problem could be solved and we could have enough housing for everybody. This kind of technology could really ameliorate such problems.

https://www.vox.com/a/new-economy-future/urban-sprawl-housin...

Post reply on HN