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Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

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Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#141

Post by Camillo »

digisign wrote: post #131
evv wrote: post #111

Kind of a fucking shame. As individuals, we are generally quite powerless in the climate crisis. The world is being ruined by companies and governments that we generally cannot influence. The power we retain: how we spend our money. Electric vehicles offer perhaps the most significant opportunity for the average consumer to improve the carbon emission status-quo. Regardless of the ecological impact, I've quickly come…

I work remotely, and leaf blowers have become the bane of my existence. Dirtier and noisier than ten modern cars. They're illegal here, but the city will not enforce.

All leaf blowers must be destroyed.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#142

Post by dd36 »

jdietrich wrote: post #62
jaytaylor wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what will change between now and 2025 to enable profitability on Bolts?

See page 42 of the source report. UBS and Munro predict a 33% reduction in battery costs due to broader industry pricing trends, with a further reduction of 10-25% on powertrain components due to economies of scale and technology improvements. The report argues that the Bolt is already profitable on a contribution basis (sale price - cost of goods sold), meaning that GM make money on every Bolt they sell. What makes…

Given that r&d is a sunk cost and that producing the vehicle is cash flow positive and will be even more so in 5 years, GM should be pedal to the metal. The loss per unit sold is a non-real accounting artifact.

Frankly, it should be accounted for on the basis of the carrying cost of the r&d debt. If I open a bakery and buy a ton of expensive equipment, I will have huge accounting losses per cookie for years but I may very well still be cash flow positive. That’s all that matters.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#143

Post by jac_no_k »

avs733 wrote: post #90
43920 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there any answers from that conversation that stood out to you in particular? I'd be really interested to hear them!

Basically...you can't build a car with a novice and expert operator mode as much sense as that would make. Also the amount of thought that goes into some decisions kinda amazed me.

Regarding "novice and expert" mode. Default should be novice mode. Extra steps to go into "expert" mode. Examples I could think of: * Launch control (maximum acceleration from a stop.) * Track mode (turn down or disable stability control) * One pedal drive mode. (Nissan Leaf e-pedal or just B-mode for strong regen)

Ah well... It would be interesting to hear more of the reasons behind decisions.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#144

Post by speedplane »

nimbius wrote: post #139

Disclosure: im an automotive engine mechanic by trade. The Volt was a political nightmare. trade rags beat this car night and day for being a fake. but honestly its a damn good car. it was never going to see tesla style torque or mileage but the people driving it werent the whole foods kind of crowd anyway. the hybrid electric was borne out of the need to create something that couldnt be patent-struck by toyota, whos…

> The Volt was a political nightmare. trade rags beat this car night and day for being a fake. but honestly its a damn good car.

So you're saying widely publicized biased opinions based on antiquated but longstanding social norms were able to prevent good engineering, measurably better than the status quo, from coming to market? Are you saying that marketing and media can often overcome solid facts? Welcome to humanity.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#145

Post by masonic »

jusssi wrote: post #127
hollerith wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, I live in California, and all the signs I see here say $3.something for gas.

I believe the GP refers to the world outside North America. Converted to your units, yesterday's average for my region was $6.12/gal. Edit: the comment reply form could show other replies, I find myself dupeing a lot because I think I'm the first one to it, with the view of no replies 10 minutes ago.

There are 28 countries with cheaper gas than the USA per https://www.globalpetrolprices.com/gasoline_prices/

(I don't know how well they account for taxes)

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#146

Post by masonic »

ip26 wrote: post #57
gok wrote: post #41

PHEVs were such a misconceived idea. So many more parts to wear out for such little benefit.

Think of phev as replacing two cars. Before you had to have one gas car and one electric, for long distance and local trips, respectively. Now with phev you can have only one car that's a bit more complex. That's the dream, anyway

  Think of phev as replacing two cars
Or as an ICE towing an EV, or vice-versa. You're lugging around both motors at all times.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#147

Post by speedplane »

dd36 wrote: post #142
jdietrich wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See page 42 of the source report. UBS and Munro predict a 33% reduction in battery costs due to broader industry pricing trends, with a further reduction of 10-25% on powertrain components due to economies of scale and technology improvements. The report argues that the Bolt is already profitable on a contribution basis (sale price - cost of goods sold), meaning that GM make money on every Bolt they sell. What makes…

Given that r&d is a sunk cost and that producing the vehicle is cash flow positive and will be even more so in 5 years, GM should be pedal to the metal. The loss per unit sold is a non-real accounting artifact. Frankly, it should be accounted for on the basis of the carrying cost of the r&d debt. If I open a bakery and buy a ton of expensive equipment, I will have huge accounting losses per cookie for years but I may…

> The loss per unit sold is a non-real accounting artifact.

GM can clearly make money from this vehicle if the tighten up their production. I'm sure engineers there know exactly what needs to be done to get there. It probably takes investment, but there will only be a return on the investment if many more Bolts are sold.

To sell more of these cars, they have to overcome public perception that they are some weird new technology. They have to make hybrid engines "feel" as solid as a Hemi. They have to make these cars known, understood, and "normal". Most people just want a car that fits in, they don't want to make a statement. This is why the blandest vehicles, e.g., Toyota Corollas are so popular.

Unfortunately, engineering rarely changes the way someone feels about a product, marketing does.

So to make the Bolt profitable, GM will need to make a significant investment in advertising and marketing to make it the new normal. They don't seem up to that.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#148

Post by timthorn »

zeroping wrote: post #109
avs733 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We talked for a while about using the onboard GPS to help the hybrid system optimize decisions about power management if it knew where you were going. We also talked about variable regenerative braking which ended up in the 2nd gen Lawyers and 'the idiot public' we're a lot of it.

I just want to know why the clock can't be set using the GPS.

At least on UK models, it gets set by RDS.

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#149

Post by [deleted] »

bit_logic wrote: post #54

This was really shortsighted. PHEV is currently the best technology. I think the push for full EV is premature for mass market. It works for niche cases like Tesla, but not something that can be truly mainstream. With current battery tech and infrastructure, EV is a 50 mile technology. It has nothing to do with battery tech itself, doesn't matter how light or dense the battery is. The limit is infrastructure. 50 mile…

[deleted]

Re: Chevy Volt discontinued: Chevrolet's last Volt rolls off the assembly line

#150

Post by eisa01 »

usrusr wrote: post #140
lrem wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to my neighbour it is no problem to drive a Tesla 2700km from Switzerland to Finland, through Germany, Czechia, Poland, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia.

Just don't pat yourself on the back too hard for that. That route takes you through some of the most CO2-intensive electricity grids. A Tesla charged in Poland is a much dirtier car than a Tesla charged in California or Switzerland. Don't get me wrong though, I'm not saying that making that trip is a terrible thing to do. I do worse things myself, e.g. traveling by plane. We all have the option of instantly reducing…

Europe has a cap on CO2 emissions through the EU ETS, so your marginal contribution to emissions is zero by driving an electric car. You’re only contribution is to increase electricity demand, and indirectly raise CO2 prices
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