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Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

nytimes.com

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Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#171

Post by [deleted] »

untog wrote: post #149
raiyu wrote: post #70

After being a resident of NYC for 30 years and seeing the city change and become a technology hub and just a financial center I think this is a real loss for NYC. It would also be in Long island City which would provide a huge influx of new workers and move that neighborhood forward in development rapidly. The down side would be that it would push some residents and business owners out but this is simply a fact of li…

Would the tax breaks eventually be offset? Amazon paid zero federal tax for the last two years running. They're experts at tax avoidance. I don't see any reason to assume they wouldn't do the same in NY.

[deleted]

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#172

Post by aaronbrethorst »

skh wrote: post #143
mc32 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What facade? CEOs? I don’t think Dems or Repubs would like to see that. Definitely not independents. We’d get the most pro-business candidate every time. Not that any candidate has been anti/business, but can you imagine, it’d be pro-business on steroids. Schultz, One of the Waltons, corporate raiders?

I think you take my comment more seriously than I intended. It's a suggestion meant to provoke thought about the nature/reality of U.S. presidential elections. With the suggestion one sees that my belief is that large corporations have far more influence on presidential elections than ordinary people like me have. But we have the facade that its actual humans that elect leaders and not the economic entities that are…

So vote for elected officials who will fight for a constitutional amendment to overturn Citizens United.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#173

Post by jhall1468 »

zelias wrote: post #55

If Amazon had just quietly announced plans to expand to LIC without the "HQ2 Search" dog and pony show they almost certainly would still be here. Google buys entire city blocks and nobody bats an eye. Turns out that publicly shaking down cities across the US tends to draw out the opposition. More publicity = more scrutiny = more angry opponents of your business decision

Google doubled their occupancy to 7k. Amazon was promising 25k jobs. I'm stunned out how so many people in this thread are pretending thats equivalent.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#174

Post by JumpCrisscross »

jhall1468 wrote: post #164
specialp wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. The 25k number was just to make a splash and notice they aren't doing that again. Because there aren't really any other areas that could give them 25k skilled employees. They will scale up in Nashville which is expected since it is a growing area, and they will still be in NY due to the talent. The "HQ2" show was primarily to extract large concessions which almost worked. My initial reaction as a NY'er was "…

There's absolutely no way they are scaling up NY to the same degree they would have with the subsidies. There's no reason to. The value proposition is gone, so now Amazon will slow-roll growth in NY like they will any other office. The fact that you (and many others) consider this a win is an attempt to revise history. This tax deal was all about Amazon expanding very quickly. That deal is gone. But feel free to pat…

> There's absolutely no way they are scaling up NY to the same degree they would have with the subsidies. There's no reason to.

There's now way to. Campus expansions are blocked by layers and layers of NIMBYs. The big selling point of the deal was the state government ensuring Amazon would have a campus that could hold 25,000 people.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#176

Post by legitster »

muraiki wrote: post #168
legitster wrote: post #59

A bit disappointed. The narrative really turned on Amazon during this process. But I feel like every organization shops around for deals - Amazon was the first company to do it transparently and openly tell cities what they have or are missing. There was a real opportunity to bring tech industry to heartland cities. In the end all they proved was this kind of stuff should just stay in the backroom. And good paying te…

I woudln't call the process transparent, since in many (all?) cases, citizens were not allowed to know the details of the negotiated deals.

They wouldn't know the details if Google or Facebook quietly shopped around either! But when they do it behind closed door they don't open up anyone to criticism.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#177

Post by kevin_b_er »

annexrichmond wrote: post #45

> We do not intend to re-open the HQ2 search at this time. We will proceed as planned in Northern Virginia and Nashville, and we will continue to hire and grow across our 17 corporate offices and tech hubs in the U.S. and Canada. So this whole HQ2 thing ended up being a grand waste of everybody's time.

The HQ2 search was likely always a facade to try to leverage their real targets. Hopefully all those other cities now realize Amazon was just playing them. Corporations can and will lie for profit. Corporations just don't like it when they get caught.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#178

Post by refurb »

CydeWeys wrote: post #13
lovecg wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if the city gets back much more in tax revenue?

No, because then it's a race to the bottom and all other companies start expecting these same deals (or even better), and eventually you do end up with a situation where the city does not get back more in tax revenue. It's simple negotiation; you may lose some money on that one deal, but you'll gain more in the end by not decreasing the value of all subsequent deals.

If a city signs up for a money losing deal, that’s on them. They should have negotiated better.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#179

Post by munificent »

raiyu wrote: post #122
tmh79 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the issue for me is that the main benefit of the tax breaks is capitalized by owners of AMZN stock, mainly Bezos, the wealthiest man in the world. AMZN is going to grow somewhere, they should pay taxes where they grow.

Yeah but they will get that tax break regardless at least this we can continue to make NYC a powerhouse tech center. And it's in Long island City not in Manhattan like Facebook and Google.

> Yeah but they will get that tax break regardless

I just don't understand this argument. It's like "Someone's gonna get fucked, so I'd prefer it be me."

That tax break is real money. Money that your community will not be able to spend on education, infrastructure, police, parks, all the things that make a place worth living in. Why would you hand that over to a company that doesn't need it?

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#180

Post by kevin_b_er »

legitster wrote: post #118
jandrese wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would't feel too bad for Amazon. They are the ones that made it a big spectacle and dragged it out for far longer than necessary or wise.

I don't necessarily feel bad for Amazon - I guess I just hate how disappointing the result was. Transparency lost. They likely could have avoided it if they had just selected one of the dark horses like Indianapolis or Saint Louis.

Amazon never intended to go with any of those "dark horses". It was just a play for a better deal elsewhere.
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