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EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

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Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#151

Post by growlist »

smcl wrote: post #87
ionised wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the UK benefitted greatly from the massive net positive contribtuions that immigration had on its economy.

I mean when you look at it purely from a "are we all demonstrably better off in the EU" perspective then sure the UK has benefitted from membership. If however you look at it from the point of view of "I hate people who look or speak different" the it's a different and frankly more miserable situation. I think the person you were replying to was of the latter persuasion.

The lazy racism smear.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#152

Post by blattimwind »

oblio wrote: post #51
pastor_elm wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Benefits of free-trade? You mean like a devastated blue collar class? Keep British products manufactured in Britain.

Didn't Britain de-industrialize of its own volition, in the 60s/70s/80s? :)

I've honestly only seen/owned at best a handful of products made in the UK. (I look at the country of origin of almost everything I buy, and I generally prefer EU-made things over Chinese-made things). Things that come to mind:

- Lorlin switches, and there is (probably "used to be") a Möller plant in the UK.

- A hammer made by Thorex. Good concept, poor quality.

- A saw made by Thomas Flinn. Poor steel.

- Fountain pen ink.

- Well that was a short list. Perhaps some English books I have were printed in UK. Though probably not.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#153

Post by Silhouette »

Tomte wrote: post #89
Silhouette wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, but I don't understand what point you're trying to make here. The comment by blibble that you replied to was about a question of sovereignty, and both the summary of why the ERG don't like the proposed WA and the likely consequences of that seem reasonably accurate to me. You seem to have introduced first the GFA and then the IRA into the discussion, but without explaining why they were relevant to the ori…

I'll spell it out: He mentioned a not-further-defined mechanism for the EU to keep unlimited control over the UK. And I clarified that this mechanism wasn't an evil plan by the EU, but instead helping the UK to meet its international obligations.

He mentioned a not-further-defined mechanism for the EU to keep unlimited control over the UK.

The actual claim was "it gives the EU effective control of the UK economy without any mechanism for the UK to leave that arrangement without the EU's permission", which is quite a different statement to what you just wrote.

In the context of the proposed Withdrawal Agreement, the mechanism in question is the proposed backstop, which as it stands requires an open border to be maintained and has no exit conditions that the UK could exercise without EU consent one way or another. The only ways to keep a fully open border established so far involve remaining within the SM and CU. Without quibbling over minutiae, the practical effect of that is pretty much what blibble wrote.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#155

Post by exhaze »

This was news a few months, wonder why it's just now hitting HN.

FYI, many import tariffs on products like cheese and meats are not immediately effectively - they gradually phase out the tariffs over a period of something like 8-10 years, so cheese will continue to be expensive for quite a while.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#156

Post by isostatic »

reubeniv wrote: post #149
isostatic wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes Come March 31st the UK has no trade deals with any country. Even the WTO schedules are up for argument in the unelected WTO court.

That's not strictly true, I know a few countries have agreed to roll over the deals the have with the EU over to the UK, not all have been signed and (not a great comfort) the only ones I know of that have (so far) are Isreal and (I think?) Australia

Australia doesn't have a trade deal with the EU, they've said that the UK leaving will not change their desire for one

Israel you're right -- they agreed it last week.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#157

Post by dalore »

btilly wrote: post #137
dalore wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It makes no sense to put it anywhere. Because you can't put a new border between Northern Ireland and Ireland. Just because it does more trade with England doesn't mean anything, that's because England is bigger. What's more important is that you can't put a border or wall or customs check really between NI and Ireland.

And this is the impasse. There are three possible outcomes here. Reverse course to remain, May's deal, or a hard Brexit. Each has about 1/3 support, and so none of them can win a vote. However the default if there is no further legislation is a hard Brexit. Now to this issue. Few want a border between the two halves of Ireland. Few want a border between Ireland and Great Britain. The price that the EU wants for no bo…

Agreed with most you say although I'd say no one really wants May's deal. The only real options left are remain or no deal and so should be put to the people. Question to the people: Is this really what you want?

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#158

Post by notahacker »

chimeracoder wrote: post #133
notahacker wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're going to open a post with "let's be accurate here" then it helps to post something which is remotely close to the truth. The withdrawal agreement ensures that the UK will leave the EU entirely within a fixed period with the exception of a tiny, economically isolated region which actually voted to remain, which would continue to be subject to some Single Market rules (to its immense economic benefit) under a…

> Irish Unionists have more obvious reasons to oppose the deal due to the symbolic importance of an Irish Sea border and their own interpretations of the GFA I'm not super caught up on the deal and the various takes. What is this referring to and what interpretation of the Good Friday Agreement is unfavorable to the deal?

The thrust of the GFA is that changes to the constitutional status of NI and other devolved decisions should be agreed between representatives of the respective unionist and republican communities (or in the case of NI choosing to leave the UK, by referendum). A customs border down the Irish Sea might not pose as many practical problems as a land border but is a pretty dramatic change in the constitutional status of Northern Ireland which unionists who consider NI to be an integral part of the UK naturally oppose. (the DUP don't talk up the GFA angle, not least because they actually originally opposed the GFA and aren't exactly upholding the spirit of it themselves, but there's a legitimate argument that the spirit of the agreement was also intended to protect unionists from having major constitutional changes imposed upon them without their consent or a public vote)

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#159

Post by btilly »

dalore wrote: post #157
btilly wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And this is the impasse. There are three possible outcomes here. Reverse course to remain, May's deal, or a hard Brexit. Each has about 1/3 support, and so none of them can win a vote. However the default if there is no further legislation is a hard Brexit. Now to this issue. Few want a border between the two halves of Ireland. Few want a border between Ireland and Great Britain. The price that the EU wants for no bo…

Agreed with most you say although I'd say no one really wants May's deal. The only real options left are remain or no deal and so should be put to the people. Question to the people: Is this really what you want?

I agree that no one really wants May's deal. It is more accurate to say that about 1/3 think that May's deal is the least bad option at this point.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#160

Post by pawelmurias »

tomp wrote: post #97
nradov wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banning GMO meat doesn't protect consumers. It's just unscientific pandering to special interest groups.

You probably meant to write allowing GMOs is pandering to special interest groups? https://qz.com/1524049/monsanto-is-at-the-center-of-a-plagia...

It's benefiting the special interest of GMO companies at the expense of the special interests of stupid people who are irrationally scared of them.
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