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A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

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Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#161

Post by yostrovs »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #146
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For claiming to be high-end brands, the amount of Gucci, Swarovski, Prada et al shops really cheapen them as a brand. I've seen similar stuff in vacation destinations in Turkey and Greece; poorly developed areas next to a road (think just bare rock and shrubs) with a super fancy looking fur coat shop. Fur coat shops, in 35+ degree C weather. I want to believe they get the odd rich Russian coming over from time to tim…

They're not "high end" brands anymore. The companies that own the brands have it down to a science, every few years they start lowering one of the more expensive brands down, and the masses start using it as a status symbol, until too many of the masses have it, then rinse repeat with another more expensive brand. See Fendi, Gucci, Swarovski, Michael Kors, etc. The most recent one I noticed was Yves Sant Lauren, with…

They can always come up with another hard to pronounce French-like name.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#162

Post by dragonsh »

ksec wrote: post #137
dragonsh wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know where you got your statistics most are false, half complete or misleading. Even in place like Shanghai, its been around 15 years they built Lingang City is still empty, now waiting for Tesla factory to populate, govt spend over 38 billion dollars to build it, people bought apartment blocks seating empty or acting as construction workers living quarters. Go to a mall right next to Huangpu river near Lupu…

>I don't know where you got your statistics most are false, half complete or misleading. Official Stats? ( But as you know Official Stats could be wrong too ) I never said the City they built out NOW have to be filled within 2 years. There are some that strategically don't work and are left there like ruins. Some are waiting for their turns, some may never come. And they will likely knock those down and rebuilt again…

I am not talking of 2 years, Lingang is built for over 12-15 years and it was an idea of Shanghai government to move Pudong Govt offices to Lingang, which did not happen as no one wants to go there and it is still sparsely populated area of Shanghai with lots of empty apartments (I think over 50-60% empty) obviously bought as investment properties.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#163

Post by Chris_Jay »

adrianratnapala wrote: post #94
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2. There are empty homes in 10 year old complexes in Beijing and Shanghai. 3. Many of the ghost districts never fill up before they are torn down as eye sores. Kangbashi will only fill up if coal makes a big come back, which is highly unlikely. Tianjin financial district is mostly a bust so far, but a derelict building or two for a decade is not abnormal. The problem is really simple: China lacks a property tax, so h…

Why is it seen as a better speculative investment than other opportunities. After all, someone is left holding the bag when the investment is found to be unused -- which is a cost just as much as a tax would be. What other considerations are outweighing that cost?

One thing I found when looking into investing in Asia is that p/e ratios are... extreme.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#164

Post by foldr »

st1ck wrote: post #153
foldr wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So they all moved to the middle east This is an interesting historical claim. Which intellectuals are you thinking of that moved from Europe to the Middle East in the early Medieval period?

I was also curious and looked it up: Pagan philosophy was gradually supplanted by Christianity in the later years of the Empire, culminating in the closure of the Academy of Athens by Justinian I. Many Greek-speaking philosophers moved to the east, outside the borders of the Empire. Neoplatonism and Aristotelianism gained a stronghold in Persia, where they were a heavy influence on early Islamic philosophy. https://e…

http://www.bede.org.uk/justinian.htm

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#165

Post by conception »

pasta wrote: post #160
lazypenguin wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found a similar reality in other developing countries. 1 hour outside of Dubai you can find giant luxury apartment blocks & chalet communities with 50% occupancy of basically only foreigners. A nearby deserted mall that is stock full of the top brands of everything and anything at top-dollar (literally) but just outside the "locals" live in abject poverty and work in the 50C sun. I have also seen in it Uzbekistan w…

China is not a developing country. I don't know where you got that idea. China is the second-largest economy.

That's because it's big not because it's developed.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#167

Post by est31 »

foldr wrote: post #152
frostburg wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more accurate (somewhat) to say that a lot of intellectual activity moved. The issue is historiographically complex but the traditional view of early medieval Europe not doing a lot to advance human knowledge except in some specific (and not very abstract) fields is mostly true.

Yeah, but it's not really accurate to say that intellectual activity moved because the Church was systematically harassing philosophers.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2017/dec/28/the-darkening-...

> Shenoute is now considered a saint in the Coptic church, but his piety manifested itself in a particularly ugly guise: he was part of a gang of thugs who would break into the houses of locals whose theological views they felt to be unsound, and smash up any property they objected to on religious grounds.

> Early in the book, she describes how she was brought up in her youth to think of late-antique and medieval Christians as enlightened curators of the classical heritage, diligently copying philosophical texts and poems throughout the ages so that they were saved from oblivion. Her views in this matter have evidently shifted somewhat over time. In this book, early Christians are much more likely to close down the academies, shut temples, loot and destroy artwork, forbid traditional practices and burn books. Rather than praising Christians for preserving slivers of classical wisdom, she argues, we should acknowledge how much was knowingly erased.

And quoting another article about the same book:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/08/books/review/catherine-ni...

> And so she opens her book with a potent description of black-robed zealots from 16 centuries ago taking iron bars to the beautiful statue of Athena in the sanctuary of Palmyra, located in modern-day Syria. Intellectuals in Antioch (in ancient Syria) were tortured and beheaded, as were the statues around them.

I personally find that it's very important to know the past, so that it won't be repeated in the future.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#168

Post by seanmcdirmid »

Chris_Jay wrote: post #163
adrianratnapala wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it seen as a better speculative investment than other opportunities. After all, someone is left holding the bag when the investment is found to be unused -- which is a cost just as much as a tax would be. What other considerations are outweighing that cost?

One thing I found when looking into investing in Asia is that p/e ratios are... extreme.

Purchase to rent ratios are also extreme in china. Good investing is tough.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#169

Post by btbuildem »

setgree wrote: post #123

In 2012, I traveled for about 6 weeks in China. I saw a lot of large cities -- not the megalopolises of Beijing and Shanghai but Guangzhou, Xi'an, Kunming -- with unreal amounts of what looked like high-end real estate going up. if you moved to the countryside, things got a lot poorer, so there was a pretty clear disconnect. But the weirder thing was endlessly empty malls. For whatever reason, high-end luxury malls h…

That is an artifact of the communist way of thinking -- central committee, five year plan, etc. Forging ahead on will and politic alone, with little regard for reality, demand, supply. It is fascinating to see it combined with the forces of capitalism.. like some strange hybrid, one animal with the head of another.

Re: A Fifth of China’s Homes Are Empty (2018)

#170

Post by hylaride »

pasta wrote: post #160
lazypenguin wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found a similar reality in other developing countries. 1 hour outside of Dubai you can find giant luxury apartment blocks & chalet communities with 50% occupancy of basically only foreigners. A nearby deserted mall that is stock full of the top brands of everything and anything at top-dollar (literally) but just outside the "locals" live in abject poverty and work in the 50C sun. I have also seen in it Uzbekistan w…

China is not a developing country. I don't know where you got that idea. China is the second-largest economy.

Yes, it's the 2nd largest economy because it's got over a billion people. Per capita GDP is about 1/5 of the US. But that's not evenly split. Leave the east coast of china, and it gets poorer fast.
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